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  1. #1
    Brevity is greatly overrated brandaggio's Avatar
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    Kill the Cat That Kills the Bird?


  2. #2
    I hate Spammers mobyme's Avatar
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    Interesting. The domestic/feral cat is definitely a killer but in some ways thats a good thing because they kill rats and mice as well. I have neighbours who have four cats, but their cats are all fitted with bells and they seldom manage to catch anything. I'm not a cat lover in the slightest but I can't go along with killing them. The capture, neuter and return idea makes a lot of sense to me.
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  3. #3
    Brevity is greatly overrated brandaggio's Avatar
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    The bell idea is a good one.

    With this being such a widespread issue with so many sides to pick, I am very surprised less folks chimed in - should have been mentioning something about American Football or from the O'Reilly Factor and then maybe I would have gotten some eyeballs .

    No worries though. I do know that the cats I have had over the years have killed a lot of birds, but yeah that is what they were born to do and all so as much I like birds, I have a hard time passing judgment on a cat for just being a cat.

    Mandatory bells for outdoor cats (with owners) that are not feral, seems like a sensible first mandate, at least/especially in areas where the birds that are being preyed upon are protected and/or within a sanctuary of some sort.
    Last edited by brandaggio; Dec 10, 2007 at 08:19.

  4. #4
    SitePoint Member JustRyan's Avatar
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    My cat is just fat and lazy. She rarely wants to go out. She just wants to sleep and eat!

  5. #5
    Galactic Overlord gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy
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    It's the circle of life. Why would you try and change it?

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    I hate Spammers mobyme's Avatar
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    If you don't mind the eradication of many species of birds do nothing. The domestic/feral cat has been introduced all over the world often accidentally by Europeans but also as pets. Normally the number of predators in any given area is determined by the amount of prey available all year round; however with cats this doesn't apply because they are either fed at home or live feral feeding on human food waste. This means that there are lots of cats around when birds are at their most vulnerable while nesting and fledging. Recent studies have shown that the domestic/feral cat is responsible for the loss of 1.6 billion birds each year in the US alone which is backed up by a study in England (not the UK as a whole) that showed 5 million cats killed 70 million birds in a year. You cannot blame the cat after all it is just being a cat but we are going to have to do something; when I had greyhounds they used to love killing cats but I did everything in my power to stop them and I would have thought that every responsible cat owner would try to do the same for birds.
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    Galactic Overlord gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy
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    I see your point. If my cats ever killed anything other than sparrows (which are also introduced and are in no way threatened) I guess I'd take some action. I have no idea what though.

  8. #8
    Keep Moving Forward gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAWK
    It's the circle of life. Why would you try and change it?
    The "circle of life" was already changed when the cats were introduced.

    Especially as house-cats are one animal that just hunt for fun... not for food... not for survival.

    I don't agree with wildly killing them... it's like vigilante justice of the animal world... but I do think that laws to make cat owners more responsible for their animals' behaviours need to be installed (or enforced, as the case may be).




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    Keep Moving Forward gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAWK
    I see your point. If my cats ever killed anything other than sparrows (which are also introduced and are in no way threatened) I guess I'd take some action. I have no idea what though.
    Dammit... I hate when I reply to someone and they already reply to themselves.

    Delete your post so mines would go on top. I'll allow you to type it over afterward perhaps.




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  10. #10
    Galactic Overlord gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy
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    House cats hunt because it is innate cat behaviour.

    And you don't really want to encourage me into post deleting. You might find yourself wasting a lot of time typing for nothing.

  11. #11
    I hate Spammers mobyme's Avatar
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    Not having a go at you Hawk ( I'm not that brave) but seems that cats are or have been quite a problem in New Zealand: So much so that they were even forced to introduce a cat eradication programme at one stage
    Cats on Islands: Because some island bird populations evolved
    in the absence of mammalian predators, they have no defense
    mechanisms against them.When cats are introduced or abandoned
    on an island,elimination of entire bird populations can result.
    Domestic cats are considered primarily responsible for the extinction of 8 island bird species, including Stephens Island Wren,
    Chatham Island Fernbird, and Auckland Island Merganser, and the
    eradication of 41 bird species from New Zealand islands alone.
    On Marion Island in the Sub-Antarctic Indian Ocean, cats were
    estimated to kill 450,000 seabirds annually prior to cat eradication
    efforts.(Veitch,C.R.1985.Methods of eradicating feral cats from
    offshore islands in New Zealand. ICBP Technical Publication 3: 125-
    141).
    There are three kinds of men:
    The ones that learn by reading.
    The few who learn by observation.
    The rest of us have to pee on the electric fence.

  12. #12
    Keep Moving Forward gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAWK
    House cats hunt because it is innate cat behaviour.
    I know. It's why I like them.

    But what I mean is, if they aren't hunting in order to survive then it's just wasteful and robbing a more "needy animal" (so to speak) of the meal.

    This is, of course, also the reason I hate sport-hunting. Plus, how could planting your fat-*** behind a tree and shooting a defense-less animal with a high-powered gun be a "sport" ??

    See now if the hunter had like a pair of flip-flops and an ice-pick and had to run down and catch the deer himself... THAT would be a sport. Hell I'd even watch him hunt a chicken!!


    And you don't really want to encourage me into post deleting. You might find yourself wasting a lot of time typing for nothing.
    Bah. HAWK, you wouldn't d-















  13. #13
    I hate Spammers mobyme's Avatar
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    See now if the hunter had like a pair of flip-flops and an ice-pick and had to run down and catch the deer himself... THAT would be a sport. Hell I'd even watch him hunt a chicken!!
    Want to see something really funny; try watching an old geezer like me (top speed flat out about 10 mph) trying to stop a greyhound (top speed 40mph) catching a cat (top speed about 15mph but with the cornering ability of a speedway motorcycle) I'm told by numerous neighbours it used to be bloody hilarious.
    There are three kinds of men:
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    The few who learn by observation.
    The rest of us have to pee on the electric fence.

  14. #14
    Brevity is greatly overrated brandaggio's Avatar
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    Something about cats in threads always leads down all sorts of twists and bends ...

    Cats are just really highly adapted, supreme hunters - it is almost as though they are too skilled for their own good/victims of their success - and as Shaun sort of mentioned, it is something that can be admired and respected on a certain level (retractable claws, vertical leaping ability etc. - the pure skill that can be at play) while also just wishing they were a little more benign when out and about in the hood...maybe some "kitty Prozac" to pacify them all so they just stare up at the birds in apathy (99% kidding).

  15. #15
    Galactic Overlord gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy
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    Quote Originally Posted by mobyme View Post
    Cats on Islands: Because some island bird populations evolved
    in the absence of mammalian predators, they have no defense
    mechanisms against them.When cats are introduced or abandoned
    on an island,elimination of entire bird populations can result.
    Domestic cats are considered primarily responsible for the extinction of 8 island bird species, including Stephens Island Wren,
    Chatham Island Fernbird, and Auckland Island Merganser, and the
    eradication of 41 bird species from New Zealand islands alone.
    On Marion Island in the Sub-Antarctic Indian Ocean, cats were
    estimated to kill 450,000 seabirds annually prior to cat eradication
    efforts.(Veitch,C.R.1985.Methods of eradicating feral cats from
    offshore islands in New Zealand. ICBP Technical Publication 3: 125-
    141).
    Ah, I think the key words there being offshore islands. We have lots of islands that are bird sanctuaries and I have no doubt that cats would wreak absolute havoc there. In those particular cases I agree that cats should be eradicated.

    I was referring solely to central Auckland and my cats, who bring in the occasional sparrow but nothing else.

  16. #16
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    I have four cats and would not be very happy if one of them had been killed in this way. There are huge amounts of birds in our area and my cats very rarely catch one. Of the four one is male and is the only one that ventures outside of our garden and goes roaming. He has a collar and a bell to let the birdies know he is coming. They are excellent at destroying rodents that dare venture into my garden which is of course why they were domesticated, apparently, in the first place.

    We have had similar stories in England where one man was going out quite regularly and killing cats. There seems to be a rise in the amount of cats that go missing lately also so I would expect it is still going on. It just is not the answer and people who carry out this kind of action have absolutely no right to call them selves any kind of animal lover and deserve to be punished as much as animal cruelty laws allow.
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