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guitarpop · Oct 30, 2009, 15:38

Hi,
I'm a student living in the US and I'm NOT a US Citizen. I'm working as a freelancer and am about to receive my first payment on odesk.com. My visa does not permit me to work in US, however the freelance work that I do is for a US company. I'm thinking of using paypal for withdrawing my money from odesk, here's the real question. Do I

a) Withdraw the money to my PayPal account and debit it to my account in my home country and wire the money from my home country to US bank?

- or -

b) Is it legal to transfer money from PayPal to my US bank account directly (paypal provides a feature to add an US bank account). In other words, will I be violating my visa rules, if so, would the govt be monitoring such kinds of transactions? and Since its through paypal and not odesk, would they come to know that it was originally from a US firm?

In any case, I want the money in my US account and option [b] seems to be the fastest. I'd love to hear your suggestions.

Thanks.

Hyperbolik · Oct 30, 2009, 16:06

I don't mean to sound like the negative one here, but isn't what you've described as freelancing actually working in the US? You've made it clear that your visa doesn't allow you to work in the US. If you're making money in the US then you should be paying taxes on that money.

If indeed that's the case, I'm not really sure why you're asking how to launder money so the US Government doesn't know that you've been working in the US which would be a violation of your visa and clearly illegal.

If I've misunderstood the situation, then I apologize.

guitarpop · Oct 30, 2009, 16:28

yeah you know what it probably sounds like that... but you see i've been freelancing before I came here and would like to continue that. I dont quite know what i'm doing is illegal or not since current US working laws, imo, are not clear about online work. Anyway the money that i'm getting is very meager and supports me only for my rent and food and I intened to keep it that way since I dont want to lose out on studies by overworking myself. I just want to know if there are others who are in similar situations. As far as my pay-pal account goes, it is registered as an Indian account. So technically I'm getting paid in India, but its just that I'm located here at the moment. I know it sounds like an open and shut case. But I wanna know how well defined work laws are in US when it comes to online/freelancing work. Thanks.

Hyperbolik · Oct 30, 2009, 16:36

If you're an Indian citizen and your PayPal account is an India account then you're probably ok, assuming that the money is sent back to the US as personal funds instead of business.

I'm not a lawyer, but it sounds like the action of transfer the funds from India to the US would be the same as if your family sent you a Western Union money transfer for personal expenses. I don't know what those limits are on personal funds entering the US. At some point they're going to want their taxes as well.

The US is different than most other countries in that if you're here (citizen or not) for more than X number of days then you own income taxes on all income made while you were on US soil. I think that number is 109 but I'm not sure. The only reason I remember that is because I have a friend who comes over from London England and he's always very careful to not stay too long otherwise he'd be required to pay US taxes. Then again, this number could be dependent on what type of visa you have.

It might not be a bad idea to consult with an immigration attorney to find out exactly what limits you need to stay within to make sure that you can keep the majority of your money to cover your expenses.

tke71709 · Oct 31, 2009, 05:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hyperbolik

It might not be a bad idea to consult with an immigration attorney to find out exactly what limits you need to stay within to make sure that you can keep the majority of your money to cover your expenses.

The money would be the least of my concerns, I would be more concerned about being kicked out of the country for violating my Visa rules.

Sagewing · Oct 31, 2009, 08:14

Sounds like you are performing services in the US and being compensated for those service - in violation of your visa. I would check out the legality of this!

El Camino · Oct 31, 2009, 11:27

IANAL. If you live in the US and do work for a US company - online or not - you are in violation of your student visa. PayPal does not currently report to the IRS but starting in 2011 they will be required to report if you have more than $20,000 in payment volume in a single year or if you receive more than 200 payments in a single year. This means that PayPal will require an SSN or EIN from US users - if they don't already.

If you earn more than $600 from oDesk and you gave them a US address they will require that you fill out a W-9 form with your Social Security Number or Employer Identification Number (EIN). My understanding is that they don't submit the W-9 to the IRS unless they are audited.

If your question is "how do I best hide my activities" then the answer is to give oDesk a foreign address and receive funds from that country. My understanding is that you cannot attach a US bank account to a PayPal account unless you live in the US and open a US (not Indian) PayPal account.

https://www.thepaypalblog.com/2008/0...ts-become-law/

guitarpop · Nov 1, 2009, 21:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by El Camino

My understanding is that you cannot attach a US bank account to a PayPal account unless you live in the US and open a US (not Indian) PayPal account.

Thanks for the comment, but I think you are wrong regarding the above fact. Check here https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/websc...nality-outside (select country as India). Plus I have a registered account and I can see an option to add a US bank account number.

Jesus, this whole thread just makes me look like a bad guy

.

Sagewing · Nov 2, 2009, 07:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by guitarpop

Jesus, this whole thread just makes me look like a bad guy

.

I think that might be because you said, "My visa does not permit me to work in US, however the freelance work that I do is for a US company."

codamedia · Nov 2, 2009, 08:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by guitarpop

Jesus, this whole thread just makes me look like a bad guy

.

Walks like a duck, quacks like a duck - it's a duck!

Think about it! You know you are in violation of your student VISA and you are asking people here how to get around it without getting caught! You may not be a bad guy - but you are doing something you shouldn't be doing.

golflover · Nov 1, 2009, 21:14

I haven't tried that yet. But thanks for sharing the experience.

Oct 30, 2009, 15:38	#1
guitarpop SitePoint Enthusiast Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 42	what are my options here? Hi, I'm a student living in the US and I'm NOT a US Citizen. I'm working as a freelancer and am about to receive my first payment on odesk.com. My visa does not permit me to work in US, however the freelance work that I do is for a US company. I'm thinking of using paypal for withdrawing my money from odesk, here's the real question. Do I a) Withdraw the money to my PayPal account and debit it to my account in my home country and wire the money from my home country to US bank? - or - b) Is it legal to transfer money from PayPal to my US bank account directly (paypal provides a feature to add an US bank account). In other words, will I be violating my visa rules, if so, would the govt be monitoring such kinds of transactions? and Since its through paypal and not odesk, would they come to know that it was originally from a US firm? In any case, I want the money in my US account and option [b] seems to be the fastest. I'd love to hear your suggestions. Thanks.

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Oct 30, 2009, 16:06	#2
Hyperbolik @JeffWalden Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 784	I don't mean to sound like the negative one here, but isn't what you've described as freelancing actually working in the US? You've made it clear that your visa doesn't allow you to work in the US. If you're making money in the US then you should be paying taxes on that money. If indeed that's the case, I'm not really sure why you're asking how to launder money so the US Government doesn't know that you've been working in the US which would be a violation of your visa and clearly illegal. If I've misunderstood the situation, then I apologize.

Oct 30, 2009, 16:28	#3
guitarpop SitePoint Enthusiast Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 42	yeah you know what it probably sounds like that... but you see i've been freelancing before I came here and would like to continue that. I dont quite know what i'm doing is illegal or not since current US working laws, imo, are not clear about online work. Anyway the money that i'm getting is very meager and supports me only for my rent and food and I intened to keep it that way since I dont want to lose out on studies by overworking myself. I just want to know if there are others who are in similar situations. As far as my pay-pal account goes, it is registered as an Indian account. So technically I'm getting paid in India, but its just that I'm located here at the moment. I know it sounds like an open and shut case. But I wanna know how well defined work laws are in US when it comes to online/freelancing work. Thanks.

Oct 30, 2009, 16:36	#4
Hyperbolik @JeffWalden Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 784	If you're an Indian citizen and your PayPal account is an India account then you're probably ok, assuming that the money is sent back to the US as personal funds instead of business. I'm not a lawyer, but it sounds like the action of transfer the funds from India to the US would be the same as if your family sent you a Western Union money transfer for personal expenses. I don't know what those limits are on personal funds entering the US. At some point they're going to want their taxes as well. The US is different than most other countries in that if you're here (citizen or not) for more than X number of days then you own income taxes on all income made while you were on US soil. I think that number is 109 but I'm not sure. The only reason I remember that is because I have a friend who comes over from London England and he's always very careful to not stay too long otherwise he'd be required to pay US taxes. Then again, this number could be dependent on what type of visa you have. It might not be a bad idea to consult with an immigration attorney to find out exactly what limits you need to stay within to make sure that you can keep the majority of your money to cover your expenses.

Oct 31, 2009, 08:14	#6
Sagewing Life is short. Be happy today! Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Bangkok, Manhattan, Louisiana Posts: 3,589	Sounds like you are performing services in the US and being compensated for those service - in violation of your visa. I would check out the legality of this!

Oct 31, 2009, 11:27	#7
El Camino SitePoint Guru Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: USA Posts: 641	IANAL. If you live in the US and do work for a US company - online or not - you are in violation of your student visa. PayPal does not currently report to the IRS but starting in 2011 they will be required to report if you have more than $20,000 in payment volume in a single year or if you receive more than 200 payments in a single year. This means that PayPal will require an SSN or EIN from US users - if they don't already. If you earn more than $600 from oDesk and you gave them a US address they will require that you fill out a W-9 form with your Social Security Number or Employer Identification Number (EIN). My understanding is that they don't submit the W-9 to the IRS unless they are audited. If your question is "how do I best hide my activities" then the answer is to give oDesk a foreign address and receive funds from that country. My understanding is that you cannot attach a US bank account to a PayPal account unless you live in the US and open a US (not Indian) PayPal account. https://www.thepaypalblog.com/2008/0...ts-become-law/

Nov 1, 2009, 21:14	#11
golflover SitePoint Enthusiast Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 10	I haven't tried that yet. But thanks for sharing the experience.