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	<title>Comments on: So is third-party web design a dead business?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/</link>
	<description></description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 07 Sep 2008 11:23:50 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: eukhost</title>
		<link>http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-130295</link>
		<dc:creator>eukhost</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Dec 2006 13:11:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-130295</guid>
		<description>It's certainly not the end of third party web designing. There are still lots of companies in India and Philippines who take up web designing and development projects from US and UK. Not all clients pay less, some of them really pay well by judging the quality of the work. While asking more pay during the development of project is justified if the requirements of the client increase.

I guess this should be made clear in the very beginning before the start of the project that if the requirements increase during the course of the project which would involve more than the specified no. of hours, the designer or developer should be paid more.

Designing your own sites and promoting them doesn't necessarily mean that you are going to earn more money. Earning money from a site involves a lot more effort than just building it and making it available online.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s certainly not the end of third party web designing. There are still lots of companies in India and Philippines who take up web designing and development projects from US and UK. Not all clients pay less, some of them really pay well by judging the quality of the work. While asking more pay during the development of project is justified if the requirements of the client increase.</p>
<p>I guess this should be made clear in the very beginning before the start of the project that if the requirements increase during the course of the project which would involve more than the specified no. of hours, the designer or developer should be paid more.</p>
<p>Designing your own sites and promoting them doesn&#8217;t necessarily mean that you are going to earn more money. Earning money from a site involves a lot more effort than just building it and making it available online.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: KeithCash</title>
		<link>http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-71163</link>
		<dc:creator>KeithCash</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Oct 2006 21:27:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-71163</guid>
		<description>RIP Webdesign
Just Kidding

Most of my clients want web design, web development, search engine optimization and search engine marketing to drive traffic and create leads and sales. Just part of the whole package.

Long Live Web design.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RIP Webdesign<br />
Just Kidding</p>
<p>Most of my clients want web design, web development, search engine optimization and search engine marketing to drive traffic and create leads and sales. Just part of the whole package.</p>
<p>Long Live Web design.</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ryechi</title>
		<link>http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-69697</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryechi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Oct 2006 21:40:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-69697</guid>
		<description>I really don't see it as a dead end business. Many companies still consider the services of outsourcing --- especially those who wants to expand and concentrate on the core of their business without the hassle. In fact, it's one of the bread and butter of most outsourcing firms in the Philippines.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I really don&#8217;t see it as a dead end business. Many companies still consider the services of outsourcing &#8212; especially those who wants to expand and concentrate on the core of their business without the hassle. In fact, it&#8217;s one of the bread and butter of most outsourcing firms in the Philippines.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Drinky</title>
		<link>http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-66560</link>
		<dc:creator>Drinky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Oct 2006 16:06:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-66560</guid>
		<description>My sign-off comment was a little bit edge case :) basically what I was getting at is you need a good idea if you're going to build yourself a money making site (does more than pay for its hosting and development time). If you don't build sites for people who want to pay you for it, and perhaps you'll eventually come up with that idea. The bonus is that you keep your hand in the game and get paid to boot, while you are looking for your idea.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My sign-off comment was a little bit edge case :) basically what I was getting at is you need a good idea if you&#8217;re going to build yourself a money making site (does more than pay for its hosting and development time). If you don&#8217;t build sites for people who want to pay you for it, and perhaps you&#8217;ll eventually come up with that idea. The bonus is that you keep your hand in the game and get paid to boot, while you are looking for your idea.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: momekh</title>
		<link>http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-66450</link>
		<dc:creator>momekh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Oct 2006 10:00:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-66450</guid>
		<description>Again, the search for the 'sure shot' thing continues... the search for hard and fast rules; 

if web designer then {
      *insert stereotype here*
      PLUS some 'new' thinking of 
      doing everything at the "f"lick of his left
      mouse button. }
else if entreprenuer {
      *insert stereotype here*
      have your own myspace or nothing else.
      a 1.6 billion youtube or mytube or anybodystube
      would also do fine.
      }
else if dude {
      *insert stereotype here* (never ever 
       forget te stereotype).
       watch 'the big lebowski' over n over. 
       go bowling. shoot your friend.
      }

what's wrong with having no hard and fast rules? because there aint any rules. period. how about an enterprising web designer who is a millionaire? how about a businessman who hires web designers skilled to the hilt, and still barely makes it through the month? anything is possible. It is a matter of choice. You can stick to stereotypes for all the ease in decision that they provide, or you can break-some and go live.
Hmmm...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Again, the search for the &#8217;sure shot&#8217; thing continues&#8230; the search for hard and fast rules; </p>
<p>if web designer then {<br />
      *insert stereotype here*<br />
      PLUS some &#8216;new&#8217; thinking of<br />
      doing everything at the &#8220;f&#8221;lick of his left<br />
      mouse button. }<br />
else if entreprenuer {<br />
      *insert stereotype here*<br />
      have your own myspace or nothing else.<br />
      a 1.6 billion youtube or mytube or anybodystube<br />
      would also do fine.<br />
      }<br />
else if dude {<br />
      *insert stereotype here* (never ever<br />
       forget te stereotype).<br />
       watch &#8216;the big lebowski&#8217; over n over.<br />
       go bowling. shoot your friend.<br />
      }</p>
<p>what&#8217;s wrong with having no hard and fast rules? because there aint any rules. period. how about an enterprising web designer who is a millionaire? how about a businessman who hires web designers skilled to the hilt, and still barely makes it through the month? anything is possible. It is a matter of choice. You can stick to stereotypes for all the ease in decision that they provide, or you can break-some and go live.<br />
Hmmm&#8230;</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Drinky</title>
		<link>http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-65815</link>
		<dc:creator>Drinky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Oct 2006 20:32:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-65815</guid>
		<description>Edman, quite simply, no matter how good at designing and building "great" websites you may be, you still need a great idea. Otherwise you haven't got a business, and without a business there is no profit to be had and at the end of it all, all you end up with is a "great" website and 100% of no profit.

Put simply, there are more potential and actual businesses out there already that need the services of a good web-builder than there are "grest" stand-alone money making ideas floating around in the average developers head.

Unless you have the next MySpace ($550m exit sale in 18 months) its probably best to use your web-building skills to realise some other peoples ideas until you do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Edman, quite simply, no matter how good at designing and building &#8220;great&#8221; websites you may be, you still need a great idea. Otherwise you haven&#8217;t got a business, and without a business there is no profit to be had and at the end of it all, all you end up with is a &#8220;great&#8221; website and 100% of no profit.</p>
<p>Put simply, there are more potential and actual businesses out there already that need the services of a good web-builder than there are &#8220;grest&#8221; stand-alone money making ideas floating around in the average developers head.</p>
<p>Unless you have the next MySpace ($550m exit sale in 18 months) its probably best to use your web-building skills to realise some other peoples ideas until you do.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Edman</title>
		<link>http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-65712</link>
		<dc:creator>Edman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Oct 2006 12:49:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-65712</guid>
		<description>

&lt;blockquote&gt;I think one can design great web sites for their own purposes, and also get out there and market your knowledge and wisdom at a high price to firms and clients that will pay big bucks for the results you can get.&lt;/blockquote&gt;


Why bother marketing your knowledge? Why bother building a good site for other people when you can build it for yourself and take 100% of the profit? Not only do you enjoy being your own boss, but you also reap all the rewards for your work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote>I think one can design great web sites for their own purposes, and also get out there and market your knowledge and wisdom at a high price to firms and clients that will pay big bucks for the results you can get.</blockquote>
<p>Why bother marketing your knowledge? Why bother building a good site for other people when you can build it for yourself and take 100% of the profit? Not only do you enjoy being your own boss, but you also reap all the rewards for your work.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Drew</title>
		<link>http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-64872</link>
		<dc:creator>Drew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Oct 2006 13:15:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-64872</guid>
		<description>I have to add almost all the people on this blog are connecting and I'm going to repeat you are selling a business to people. Web and creative types have to now look 'coperate' not 'chic' or stylish. 
A sharp business suit will get you more jobs than 'geek chic' and that's not to say it's not up to you what you look like but if you don't look the part you will not be a part. 

Business people do business with business people whether they look cool or not but it's human nature to be more receptive to your preconcived notions on what a busisness man looks like. 

Continuous development of self is another tool stay ahead of the game do not pigeon hole yourself if you need more programming education go and get it. If you need more graphics knowledge find a way to expand on what you have. The only barrier between you and your next big client is your view of yourself and what your skills are worth. If someone doesn't want to pay for the full monty give 'em as much as you think they paid for. Wet a persons appitite if they see the potential they will go for it regardless of their previous estimation.

Finally ask for help if your only companions are pride,arrogance and ego then make room for their cousins poverty, misery and depression.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to add almost all the people on this blog are connecting and I&#8217;m going to repeat you are selling a business to people. Web and creative types have to now look &#8216;coperate&#8217; not &#8216;chic&#8217; or stylish.<br />
A sharp business suit will get you more jobs than &#8216;geek chic&#8217; and that&#8217;s not to say it&#8217;s not up to you what you look like but if you don&#8217;t look the part you will not be a part. </p>
<p>Business people do business with business people whether they look cool or not but it&#8217;s human nature to be more receptive to your preconcived notions on what a busisness man looks like. </p>
<p>Continuous development of self is another tool stay ahead of the game do not pigeon hole yourself if you need more programming education go and get it. If you need more graphics knowledge find a way to expand on what you have. The only barrier between you and your next big client is your view of yourself and what your skills are worth. If someone doesn&#8217;t want to pay for the full monty give &#8216;em as much as you think they paid for. Wet a persons appitite if they see the potential they will go for it regardless of their previous estimation.</p>
<p>Finally ask for help if your only companions are pride,arrogance and ego then make room for their cousins poverty, misery and depression.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: b0rdslide</title>
		<link>http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-64824</link>
		<dc:creator>b0rdslide</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Oct 2006 10:07:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-64824</guid>
		<description>It's all about developing re-usable solutions. If you create a software base that can be used for any run-of-the-mill site without re-coding it every time and is easily extended for unique requirements then you can typically cut your development time in half if not more. You can usually still charge the full-price for the development as you have already put a lot of man-hours into developing this solution that lets you deploy the clients site a lot quicker.

It's also about after-market services. A lot of our work comes from training/consultation and building a relationship where you hand-hold a client throughout their on-line transition. Not only do you get continued revenue from support but you're first in-line whenever any further development work needs to be done.

A lot of younger startups also seem to forget that _all_ the time that you spend on a clients project should be chargeable. If you have a large project and you need to spend a week just getting a detailed spec put together, make sure the client is paying for that - treat it as a seperate job from the actual development and quote/invoice accordingly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s all about developing re-usable solutions. If you create a software base that can be used for any run-of-the-mill site without re-coding it every time and is easily extended for unique requirements then you can typically cut your development time in half if not more. You can usually still charge the full-price for the development as you have already put a lot of man-hours into developing this solution that lets you deploy the clients site a lot quicker.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s also about after-market services. A lot of our work comes from training/consultation and building a relationship where you hand-hold a client throughout their on-line transition. Not only do you get continued revenue from support but you&#8217;re first in-line whenever any further development work needs to be done.</p>
<p>A lot of younger startups also seem to forget that _all_ the time that you spend on a clients project should be chargeable. If you have a large project and you need to spend a week just getting a detailed spec put together, make sure the client is paying for that - treat it as a seperate job from the actual development and quote/invoice accordingly.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: momekh</title>
		<link>http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-64783</link>
		<dc:creator>momekh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Oct 2006 07:42:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sitepoint.com/blogs/2006/10/05/so-is-third-party-web-design-a-dead-business/#comment-64783</guid>
		<description>The last part on Andrew's 'comment', I agree with 100 percent. Classical web design 'firm' is dead, or almost dead. Currently, I feel 'success' in web design as a full time bread earner is through 'consultancy/facilitation' of web design rather than a bunch of designers sitting together to code and get clients, code and get client. a company specializing in not web design, but in 'client relationships'. 
thats my $0.02 ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The last part on Andrew&#8217;s &#8216;comment&#8217;, I agree with 100 percent. Classical web design &#8216;firm&#8217; is dead, or almost dead. Currently, I feel &#8217;success&#8217; in web design as a full time bread earner is through &#8216;consultancy/facilitation&#8217; of web design rather than a bunch of designers sitting together to code and get clients, code and get client. a company specializing in not web design, but in &#8216;client relationships&#8217;.<br />
thats my $0.02 ;)</p>]]></content:encoded>
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