I’m wondering how much time you would spend in Photoshop to design 2 templates for a website: a homepage and a content page.
If you do a nice but simple design (simple to implement, no complex javascript or interaction)
If you design it so it will have some cool interaction going on as on this website http://www.theshowmn.org/
I know it’s a bit vague but I’m always asked to design websites in a day or 2 when I feel it would need a bit more time.
Good questions, Raphaelle. I’m not an expert at this (and look forward to what others have to say) but from my experience so far, I think it’s reasonable to knock out a Ps design in a day or two in the first scenario.
The second is a little more complicated, as you can’t really work out too much interaction in Ps. I guess you could have layers that turn off and on to mimic page behaviors. But I’m sure the site you linked to took quite a while (and many iterations) to reach that form. It’s really a work of art, and probably a lot of discussions, trial and error got it to that stage.
I work with a very good graphic designer, and it usually takes him several days to be happy enough with an initial design to show to a client. Usually that first design ends up looking nothing like the final layout.
Thanks for your feedback ralph.m. It is a tricky question, isn’t it. I agree with you about the first scenario; it’s pretty straight forward so a day or two is enough.
I really want to do something special for the project I’m going to be working on shortly. I’m thinking of some kind of interaction in a similar way as on the website I gave as an example. But how to estimate how much time it will take?
My boss wants me to evaluate how much time it would take me in both scenarios (and including HTML and CSS because I do that part too) but it’s always hard for me to answer. I need time in Photoshop before I can see what’s going to happen on the page. But it doesn’t work that way, everything has to be decided beforehand with the client, budget and stuff, which is fair enough.
Anyway, looking forward to hearing more feedback
I know someone who can make 2 designs in a day that are of the same quality as templatemonster designs. Depends on both the talent of the designer, and the requirements of the design…
No more than a week. If it’s more than that you’re just wasting valuable time.
If you’re not good at creating websites I would just buy a premade template from either a joomla club or a wordrpess club.
Shall we not make this about how good a designer I am please? That wasn’t the aim of my post. I’m a more than decent designer, but I’ve always found hard to evaluate how much time I should spend on projects and I want to hear about how you see this.
If you look at the first post I sent I was describing 2 scenarios. In scenario 1) I can imagine how that would take less than a week to design and to do the front-end. In scenario 2 I’m not sure.
I don’t really believe in designing 2 websites in a day unless you are given absolutely all the elements of content perfectly in order and optimised, all graphic material straight away, and you have good wireframes done for you. If you have some prep work to do then surely it needs a little bit of thinking. But then if you produce very basic websites which are always on the same template, I can imagine how one would be very quick at getting one done.
Thing is, there is no answer to this question and how good you are is very relevant. If it takes you three days to do a design and for what ever reason your clients are prepared to pay accordingly then that’s how long you should take to do a design. If they’re not prepared to pay for three days work on a design, then the answer is two days… one day… half a day… etc etc
What’s the minimum time you can do it in? That’s what the client wants. I charge a day for the design, some take less, some take more, it evens out in the long run.
I agree, all designers will work at a slightly different pace.
I thought the debate would be a little more interesting if we talked about the different ways of going about a website. Surely even if it will have only 2 or 3 different page templates, you can produce a very simple solution in a short amount of time, or you can spend a bit more time and do something completely original and a bit more complex.
You guys sound like all websites are pretty much the same; you just reuse a template and add a bit of design touch and that’s it. That can work for some projects.
What interests me is how deep you can/should go into a project. You might have a client that needs a website for a concert venue and you’ve got loads of cool ideas of things you could do, but there are many ways you can go about doing such a website. It could be a bunch of pages, all the same template, and you can even start from a Wordpress theme and change it so it reflects the brand. Or you can have completely original ideas that would need more time to produce.
I don’t believe all websites are a matter or a day or 2. At least you can offer different solutions and prices to a client and they choose how much work they want you to put in.
Have you looked at the example I gave in my first post? http://www.theshowmn.org/
Don’t tell me you’d be able to produce that in a day or 2 because I wouldn’t believe you.
They are pretty much the same for most webdesigners because most clients don’t require something artsy and unique and expensive. My designs follow a standard layout because that’s the my client’s customers need, something familiar and easy to make sense of quickly, easy to navigate.
I don’t do ‘original’ because my target demographic doesn’t need original. Maybe you first of all need to figure out who your designs are aimed at because the answer isn’t ‘anyone who needs a design’, not when you look at who you most often do designs for, they’re your bread and butter jobs. If you’re getting a lot of requests for 2 day websites, maybe you have another target demographic you can work for and you’ll have to adjust your working practices accordingly.
Well then, you’ve kind of answered your own question there then haven’t you.
I get your point, but I’m not a freelancer, I’m an employee of a very very small company so it’s a bit different. I’m often asked to quickly evaluate how much time I’d spend on something so my boss can give a quote.
Often the clients themselves don’t know what they want or need, sometimes they’ll be friends of friends of my boss and I’m supposed to say : here is what I’d do in this amount of time, and here is what I’d do if I get more time.
It’s early stages for my company and we want to produce some cool stuff, not just the templated stuff, even though there is nothing wrong with that.
I think sometimes, for a client that has a bit of money, it’s interesting to think out of the box and take time to do something different. But how to quantify it? I find that hard to say when it’s early stages.
Well then maybe you’re going to have to do 3 days work for the price of one to earn your rep etc. Either that, or do a one day design and charge a day for it.
It all boils down to the needs of your target demographic (and your skill in identifying that need if they’re uncertain, I go through a questionnaire with new clients for that bit) To give a quote, you have to know what the client wants and what their budget is.
this is the best site i have ever seen!!! ^___^
Personally I would set out from the start with a client that although they think a website can be done to a great standard in a day or two you should push to get that extra day, especially for tweaks and if you do deliver within their original timeframe you become a little better thought of in their eyes I have found. Nice site by the way 
Raphaelle, my advice would be to time yourself on every project you undertake… you can categorise your results based on complexity or the tasks being done and it’ll give you a more tailored idea of how much time you spend on each project doing each task. Everyone does things differently and has a different pace which of course makes it hard to personalize it to an estimate you could aim for. Timing yourself will yield more long term and more accurate results.
I am need a week.
php mysql design.
Knowing how much time something will take just comes from experience. I’ve been in the business for about 15 years now, and there are still times where I have difficulty giving an estimate. Every project is different. But you asked for some specific examples, so here is how long I normally take:
1). Static HTML/CSS template: I can bang out the design in a day usually, and then I’ll need two days to build it to make sure everything is working properly.
2). Sites with high levels of interaction: Unknown. If something I’m working on requires a lot of coding, I’ll hand it off to a dedicated programmer. I’m a designer first, web developer second. My time is better spent doing the visual design and basic HTML/CSS creation (and not mucking around with code).
I quote by time but a colleague of mine quotes by how much he thinks the job is worth to the client, i.e. how much he thinks he can get them to pay. Each to their own but it’s another option in the great ‘how to quote’ debate.
Are you talking design, lay out or code?
DESIGN:
LAYOUT
If it’s just a wire frame type job… 2-3 maybe an extra day to debug for non-compliant browsers ( tho that’s seldom asked for wireframes)
CODE:
well thats where it all hits the fan… some simple interaction I keep as snippets and at the WORSE CASE SCENARIO modifying these snipets may take a day or two, if they want something like a new app… it could take 2 weeks.
In the link provided… was not a 3 day website for sure. There was a CONCEPT behind it it. There must also have been some illustration time involved in that ( possibly even character development?)… all before any PSD was put together, or wire frame or any other java/css /flash. MHO, at least.
For me it comes down to how inspired I am by the project. Kinda sucks but it is true. I have had difficult sites that I have pumped out in amazingly short amounts of time because I was enthused about the project and on the flip side have had easy projects take WAY to long because I couldn’t be arsed to care about it. This, of course, does not help in your quest for the perfect answer. I would give 2 days max for option #1 and let my boss know that the second option would have to be quoted on a per case basis as there is no definite answer to how long “the Show '09” site would take me.
Surely this is a case of the blind, leading the blind. It depends on the level of depth and effort put into the work to how long it will take. I could push out an HTML template within a couple of days but it wouldn’t be nearly as carefully crafted or effective or even aesthetically pleasing as something I have longer on.
I see it as a case of: Speed, Price, Quality… pick two.