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  1. #151
    Destiny Manager Plebius's Avatar
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    "In the Bible, it is pretty clear that impure things are sinful, and it also states that lusting for a maried women (or vise-versa) is a sin. "

    Is it a sin if the married woman is married to you? hehe.

  2. #152
    SitePoint Wizard TWTCommish's Avatar
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    Hehe...uh, no, I don't think so.

  3. #153
    SitePoint Addict Chris Roane's Avatar
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    hahehe....you caught me there.

    I meant that lusting after another maried women, besides your own is sinful. Lusting after your own wife is not. In fact, I plan on doing that when I get married.

    Also, I don't think it is sinful to lust after a women if you aren't married. However, acting upon that lust is a dirrerent story, IMO.

    Chris Roane

  4. #154
    SitePoint Wizard TWTCommish's Avatar
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    Sorry Chris, but lusting after anyone other than your wife at any time is a sin. I believe the Bible says that "if a man lusts after a woman, he has already, in his heart, committed adultery with her"...or something like that.

    Lust usually involves a sexual fantasy of some sort...it's a sin...don't feel bad - it's unavoidable...the second you try NOT to think about it, you do! It's just our nature.

  5. #155
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    Sooo.. when do we break into the 'My god is better than YOUR god' arguement?

    Please, people. This is really becoming a technical arguement over what we all believe in. [Actually, it's kind of degraded into a proverbial mud slinging contest.] Because of human nature, we're not going to agree.

    Personally, I don't hold all of the Christian ethics to be true. Some of the stuff just sounds like a scare tactic. But oh well. Let's burn me. Yay.

    Calm down, take a step back, everyone. This thread's become extremely out of hand, and off topic.

    And now... for my crew.. raise the sheild, before they start throwing bottles!

  6. #156
    SitePoint Wizard TWTCommish's Avatar
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    Wha? Are we reading the same messages? This hasn't involved mud slinging...and we've all remained pretty respectful. Off topic, yes...but there's no rule against that.

  7. #157
    SitePoint Wizard
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    I wouldn't go so far as to say it's a mud-slinging contest but it has gotten into a civilized argument about which religion is best. But as you said it's human nature to disagree on things like this.

    I must say you know the conversation is either heated or degrading when people start using "You said:" and "My reply:" headings to their posts :P

    p.s. this post is twice as long as the longest post before it, or something like that..

  8. #158
    Destiny Manager Plebius's Avatar
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    Originally posted by d3v

    p.s. this post is twice as long as the longest post before it, or something like that..
    It's because of the separate pages with vbulletin. Before people would just stop looking when the page got too long.


  9. #159
    SitePoint Wizard
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    Originally posted by LuZeR
    It's because of the separate pages with vbulletin. Before people would just stop looking when the page got too long.

    Good point...but still when posts got really long it was separated into <name> #2 or something like that. So I must say this post should recieve the honors...

    Let's not have this one closed because of babbling like that Creation vs Evolution was....

  10. #160
    SitePoint Addict Chris Roane's Avatar
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    TWTCommish....I agree with you in that you shouldn't lust after any other women besides your wife, if you are maried. However, God made us to be attracted to our opposite sex, and I don't think it is wrong to look at another women and be attracted to her.

    Hypertrophy....I really don't think this discussion isn't as bad as you may think it is, and yes it is human nature to disagree with each other. But you can't say we aren't learning anything, I mean we all are finding out more info about each others beliefs and religions. I know I have enjoyed my time in this thread.

    -------------------
    Hypertrophy
    Personally, I don't hold all of the Christian ethics to be true. Some of the stuff just sounds like a scare tactic. But oh well. Let's burn me. Yay.
    -------------------

    I won't burn you and I kind of feel offended that some people always think that us "Christians" will beat you up to a bloody pulp, just because you don't like some things that we do. I could careless what anyone believes in, hell, you could worship SitePoint if you really wanted to, and I would careless. I just think I have the RIGHT to defend my religion when people are going against it and saying bad things about it.

    No more replies for me in this thread. I am not going to say anything anymore. If you want to ask me a question or talk to me, you can do so with the following info:

    E-Mail: chris@intersurge.com
    ICQ: 81278659
    MSN Messanger: devstormsite@hotmail.com

    I would love to talk to anyone that is interested in chatting with me.

    Cya and nice talking with everyone.

    Chris Roane

  11. #161
    SitePoint Wizard TWTCommish's Avatar
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    Originally posted by wsresource

    TWTCommish....I agree with you in that you shouldn't lust after any other women besides your wife, if you are maried. However, God made us to be attracted to our opposite sex, and I don't think it is wrong to look at another women and be attracted to her.
    Attraction and lust are two very different things. See my earlier post describing what I think lust is. Attraction is fine...but I think it's say we think more than "Boy, she sure is purdy!"


    Originally posted by wsresource

    you could worship SitePoint if you really wanted to, and I would careless.
    Matt and Co. are loving this.

    Quinn: I know that was a reference to me...hehe. I think when people (like me) use a format like that it simply means that they take the conversation/argument seriously and whatever everything clear. It's definetly need in a giant, winding thread such as this anyway.

  12. #162
    SitePoint Wizard
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    Originally posted by TWTCommish

    Quinn: I know that was a reference to me...hehe. I think when people (like me) use a format like that it simply means that they take the conversation/argument seriously and whatever everything clear. It's definetly need in a giant, winding thread such as this anyway.
    I didn't mean it to insult you if that's what you thought. It's just an indicator of a popular or heated conversation...

    Just wanted to clear that up.

  13. #163
    SitePoint Wizard TWTCommish's Avatar
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    Not upset...hence the "hehe"

  14. #164
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    wow, what a topic! This has really beaten all previous long-post records. = )

    here are my opinions on a few controversial issues raised in previous messages

    --------
    Evolution
    --------
    As a Christian, I believe the Genesis account, literally. Evolution can occur on a micro-scale, such as where it could defined actually as being adaptation and not evolution, but not on a macro-scale - infamous amoeba to cow example = ) - that cannot be scientifically proven and has yet to be seen.
    As for dinosaurs, the Bible clearly mentions them in Job as "behemoths", and giants of the deep. As for their extinction, the Flood can't be ruled out...since it only left a pair from each kind and due to their size, mankind may have hunted them down.
    Evolution also can't answer the questions that begs to be asked when the "Big Bang" theory arises - Where did that big bang come from? How can a huge cataclysmic, universe-creating event happen from nothing?

    ------------
    Christianity
    ------------
    Something that has come up is the inclusion of the Catholic Church in the same group with born-again Christians. Sure, Catholics are included as Christians but their beliefs differ dastrically from the beliefs of a born-again Christian.
    As for the Pope, he may be a good man, but he is only the pawn leader of a huge organization, which is the Catholic Church, which is more preocuppied with filling its coffers than with the well-being of the world. I am not saying that they could care less about the famines in Third-World countries, but that is not part of their main agenda. They are easily one of the wealthiest "corporations" in the world, just visit the Vatican to see that.
    By creating a theology that involves indulgences and the need to pay for each individual sin, they provided a way to financially support the church. Nowhere in the Bible does it mention that after Christ, you have to go to a priest and confess your sins.

    To all those who disagree with me, I believe in a truth. That means that one of us is seeing the truth in a right way. I dont believe that you can have a view and I can have a different view on the same thing and yet we are both right - relativism. I may not see the whole truth but I do search for as much understanding of the truth as possible.
    To me, that truth is God, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit. And there can only be one truth. So if you believe in Bhuddism, Atheism, etc, one of us is right. One day we will know who is right. And I rest assured that the truth is God. Believe it or not, you will when He returns.
    This may sound a bit self-assured, like I have the light and everyone else doesn't but the fact of the matter is that there is only one truth, so not all of us will be right. So I highly suggest that you think over what you believe, because it matters.

  15. #165
    Fluffy Kitten Programmer~ Elledan's Avatar
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    'How do thou know whether thou are seeing the truth? Thou don't. Truth comes in pieces, like a cloud that covers it. In short periods, thy mind will see fragments of it, but truth always exceeds our grasp.'

    www.nyanko.ws - My web-, software- and game development company.
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  16. #166
    SitePoint Wizard TWTCommish's Avatar
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    For once I agree with you Elledan! I cannot see the whole truth at once. Nobody can...if we could, this argument would've never gotten started.

    Nice post, micah. I agree: things like this are important. People may think "Oh, I dunno about all this...whatever happens, happens"...but this is a very important thing. If some of the major religions are right, then there are consequences. Everyone should try to learn more about the issue and make a decision, I think.

  17. #167
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    Originally posted by micahgoulart

    --------
    Evolution
    --------
    As a Christian, I believe the Genesis account, literally. Evolution can occur on a micro-scale, such as where it could defined actually as being adaptation and not evolution, but not on a macro-scale - infamous amoeba to cow example = ) - that cannot be scientifically proven and has yet to be seen.
    Evolution is a series of Adaptations that amount to a completely changed organism. Also, consider that it is not an 'ameoba going to cow.' It is an ameoba going through a series of adaptations, and then the organisms that branch off from those adaptations going through more adaptations, until we have a bovine goody.

    Also, consider than each adaptation takes thousands and thousands of years to happen.

    As for dinosaurs, the Bible clearly mentions them in Job as "behemoths", and giants of the deep. As for their extinction, the Flood can't be ruled out...since it only left a pair from each kind and due to their size, mankind may have hunted them down.
    This argument holds little bearing--the extinction of the dinosaurs has pretty much been narrowed down to a meteor shower. [Don't flame me for this one, I know there are more extinction theories than there are grains of sand on a beach, but the scientic community pretty much goes with this one.

    ALSO... if this is what happened, and Noah had brought dinosaurs onto the 'arc,' then how do you explain bringing girrafes, cows, and other large mammals? Dinosaurs were -long- gone by the time large mammals had developed.


    Evolution also can't answer the questions that begs to be asked when the "Big Bang" theory arises - Where did that big bang come from? How can a huge cataclysmic, universe-creating event happen from nothing?
    You're looking for an astronomer, not a Darwin-esque scientist. :-)

    As for the rest of it.. as I said.. a scare tactic.

    But, hey, if you want to throw somebody like the pope into a General's seat, I'm all for it. The Church has been leading its followers pretty darn good for around a thousand years. [Maybe more, maybe less.]

    Edit:

    DARN. I meant 'darn'!

  18. #168
    SitePoint Wizard TWTCommish's Avatar
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    I don't know if Noah brought Dinosaurs onto the Arc with him or not. If he did, I don't see any conflict. I don't know of any proof that dinosaurs lived in a totally seperate time. We really don't know half of what we think we do about Dinosaurs...we could easily be way off. We always picture them as deadly and violent...I don't know that that is necessarily the case.

    Please don't come back with something about carbon-dating...it is flawed and a weak attempt for us to act like we know more about everything than we really do.

    As for the meteor shower...the scientific community may believe whatever they like.

    No matter how long it takes or it works...it is still an ameoba growing into a Cow...I can believe a pony into a horse perhaps, or a dog into a wolf of sorts...just not one species to another.

  19. #169
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    Scientists have yet to find an accurate way to date fossils, they use circular reasoning to date them by saying that "Because this fossil was found in this layer of rock then it is 3 billion years old. Well, how do you know this layer is 3 billion years old? It's 3 billion years old because that is how old the fossils within the layer are..."

    See what i mean...? And also when you say that dinosaurs existed in a time period before mammals and such, that is only concluded from the fact that they say dinosaurs are x million years old... Ancient-looking fossils are used to support that argument, but when you think of the effect a global flood would have on sediments and dead animals, a fossil that seems to be millions of years old could have been formed in minutes. That is because scientist date fossils and such with a presumption that the decay and aging are happen at a constant rate...which would support the millions of years...obviously...but if you take into account a world-wide flood, well, your dating gets a bit screwed up. = )

    As for my "scare tactics", I certainly did not mean it to be that way...so if you take it to be a scare tactic, then I can only conclude... = )

    If I believe in God and life after death and you do not, and if there is no God, we both lose when we die. However, if there is a God, you still lose and I gain everything.

    Just a humble opinion from a high schooler. = )
    Micah Goulart
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  20. #170
    Fluffy Kitten Programmer~ Elledan's Avatar
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    I don't hope that you're actually saying that all the scientific discoveries are false.

    If you're really certain that the bible is right, please join the Amish...

    While Christianity moved forwards at a very low speed, the rest of the world moved at lightning speed and has undergone multiple changes and made the bible look outdated.

    Christians used to believe that the Earth was the center of our solar system. When that was proven to be false, the whole Christian Community almost killed the scientists who supported this discovery. But after (too) many years, they accepted this discovery.

    Will history keep itself repeating?
    www.nyanko.ws - My web-, software- and game development company.
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  21. #171
    SitePoint Wizard TWTCommish's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Elledan
    I don't hope that you're actually saying that all the scientific discoveries are false.

    If you're really certain that the bible is right, please join the Amish...

    While Christianity moved forwards at a very low speed, the rest of the world moved at lightning speed and has undergone multiple changes and made the bible look outdated.

    Christians used to believe that the Earth was the center of our solar system. When that was proven to be false, the whole Christian Community almost killed the scientists who supported this discovery. But after (too) many years, they accepted this discovery.

    Will history keep itself repeating?
    It wasn't just Christians...it was everyone...they all thought Earth was the center of the universe, that the world was flat...blah blah blah.

    Believing the Bible does not make someone Amish, and Christianity is not moving slowly. There ARE Christians scientists...just not that many. Perhaps its because Christians put a little more time into bettering themselves and such things...just a theory.

    If history is going to keep repeating itself, then we'd all be able to predict the future. I don't think it repeats itself on too many major scales (and I mean MAJOR)...it does to some degree of course.

  22. #172
    Fluffy Kitten Programmer~ Elledan's Avatar
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    Something more on-topic: Cloning and Genetic Engineering

    These are two quite new techniques, but already people are making up the worst scenarios. It is of course true that carelessness can be punished with a deadly virus or a plant that will kill multiple other species (plants that is ).

    I think that Cloning and GE are at the stage of development that they're too inefficient and unreliable to be widely used. Sure, we must be careful, but we're not stupid...

    On the long run, cloning and GE could 'replace' the 'normal' way of reproducing. GE most likely, since having exact copies of an individual would make them all more vulnerable for illnesses.

    I don't want to say that I'm supporting those technics (cloning seems not really useful and not really dangerous to me every specie on earth is 'cloning' themselves all the time)
    I just want to hear your thoughts about it.
    www.nyanko.ws - My web-, software- and game development company.
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  23. #173
    SitePoint Addict Chris Roane's Avatar
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    There are Christian Scientists out there....and one of the most popular groups of these scientists can be found at this link: http://www.creationresearch.org/

    They are called the "Creation Research Society".....I actually was able to go to one of their seminars and they are one of the reasons why I am a Christian.

    Here is another page, that I thought you may be interested in: http://www.icr.org/goodsci/faq-gs.htm

    Just thought you would want to know.

    Chris Roane

    [Edited by wsresource on 09-03-2000 at 01:37 PM]

  24. #174
    SitePoint Addict superbird's Avatar
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    So how much do the people who are discrediting carbon dating actually know about it?
    ...KartLink...

  25. #175
    SitePoint Wizard TWTCommish's Avatar
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    I'm going by what I've heard. If you feel the need to educate me, by all means go ahead. I'll need a second opinion, of course. I'd be glad to hear any details on carbon dating you're willing to post.

    I don't like the idea of human cloning...and probably not animal cloning either. I don't see it replacing natural reproduction...works fine the way it is. They are two seperate things...so I don't think that "creatures do it all the time".


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