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  1. #1
    SitePoint Zealot Raphaelle's Avatar
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    Why is Flash so popular in France?

    I'm French but I've lived in the UK for the past 6 years and that's where I learnt to be a web designer. After working 4 years in London I've moved back to France and I'm now looking for a job.

    Most web design jobs require very strong Flash skills in France. Why is that? Some agencies only make Flash websites such as these:
    http://www.cfd-immo.com/
    http://www.choisir-asnieres.com/home.html

    Full Flash websites are very popular and are used for all kinds of websites, even small ones with just text or basic content. I don't mind a bit of Flash but I'm more for Web2.0 type of sites.

    Does anyone know why it is that way in France and whether it is going to change? What are other countries like?

    Looking forward to your input.

  2. #2
    Follow: @AlexDawsonUK silver trophybronze trophy AlexDawson's Avatar
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    Perhaps it's just coincidence in the agencies you happened to look at, full flash websites are kinda bad practice these days because while they can be more beautiful, animated and interactive with visitors there are serious accessibility, usability and SEO problems at the basic level which can be damaging to the audiance. As I said before, you probably just found some agencies that specialize in flash, I am sure it isn't the case that France as a country prefers using Flash to website development in the general perspective, otherwise your designers and developers would be unable to meet the needs of those wanting a site with large amounts of content.

  3. #3
    SitePoint Zealot Raphaelle's Avatar
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    You don't need to convince me, I'm all about accessibility and best practices. That's what I learnt in England and that's exactly what I'm passionate about.

    But believe me I'm not inventing what I say about France. I have been doing research for a few months now and this is a known fact; France is more into Flash than the UK or US. It's also a known fact that France is 2 or 3 years behind the UK and US in terms of Web, but they are also taking a slightly different direction.

    Now I'm not saying that all websites are made in Flash and there isn't a single Web2.0 made in France, I'm just saying Flash is a lot more popular and I wonder why. It pisses me off to be honest, because I want to do my job properly and I don't want to have to learn Flash in depth.

  4. #4
    Programming Since 1978 silver trophybronze trophy felgall's Avatar
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    You have to decide whether you are going to build web sites or flash sites. If the former then no knowledge whatever of flash should be required. You need to stop looking at flash site producing companies and find some that produce web sites.
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  5. #5
    SitePoint Zealot Raphaelle's Avatar
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    I apologise if I didn't explain myself properly. I wasn't looking for tips on job hunting tips; I've researched the French market for months and I'm very clear about what's going on there.

    I was wondering about the reasons behind such a difference between the French Web and the UK or US Web. I am interested to hear about other countries too.

    I'm not sure where most Sitepoint users are from, maybe you're mostly from English-speaking countries, maybe not. There is a whole world of non English-speaking countries out there, and they probably all do things differently.

    Some countries will follow the US and UK in terms of technology and techniques used, some countries will be restricted by the technology (or other parameters) and therefore their Web will evolve differently.
    Maybe it's a matter of taste and culture, causing the clients to have different expectations?
    Some countries care more about Accessibility than others, maybe because they are a bit 'behind' or maybe they just culturally don't care?

    It's a fact that Flash is still extremely popular in France compared to other places and I'm wondering why and whether it will change/evolve.

    Hope this is a bit clearer

  6. #6
    I meant that to happen silver trophybronze trophy Raffles's Avatar
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    Perhaps it's a simple marketing thing and all those people who do marketing studies for companies have come to the conclusion that the French like animation and pretty things. Accessibility might be less of a hot topic in France. I don't know what it's like in France, but the UK is very much into it, it permeates all levels of society.

    I can tell you that in Peru, Flash sites are also very popular. People find them impressive and the fact that it's pretty and animated makes people think that lots of money was spent on it, ergo the company is wealthy and doing well, so can be trusted. Not an argument that would so easily convince people in the UK, it seems to me.

  7. #7
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    Peru, I think it's the mind set of people in different parts of the world as you just mentioned. You do know that Peru has a lot of UFO sightings and I'm not saying that as a joke, seriously.

  8. #8
    I meant that to happen silver trophybronze trophy Raffles's Avatar
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    No, I didn't know that, but given the high mountains and lack of electricity and things to do in said mountains, it doesn't surprise me. Also, research from 1997-2006 has shown that people who report UFO sightings are heavily into Flash-based websites, so the link there isn't unclear at all.

  9. #9
    #titanic {float:none} silver trophy
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    For the same reason they're so popular in Spain, I guess... they're flashy people... they're all up for the animation and the spectacular special effects...

    Problem is... third time they visit the site, they get bored and go for something more fashionable.

  10. #10
    SitePoint Guru silver trophy JamesColin's Avatar
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    Perhaps you should ask this on a french webmaster forum, because on sitepoint there will only be a minority of french people, so how do you want them to explain to you what you've found out about web agencies in france?
    Have you asked the same question on http://www.webrankinfo.com which is the most well-known french forum about seo/webmastering? If so, what was their answer?
    Do you really need traffic? Where to? What for?
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  11. #11
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    I can tell you that in Peru, Flash sites are also very popular. People find them impressive and the fact that it's pretty and animated makes people think that lots of money was spent on it, ergo the company is wealthy and doing well, so can be trusted. Not an argument that would so easily convince people in the UK, it seems to me
    It's how some cultures think, a bit wonky if you ask me. I might add that North America and the UK are far from perfect there are wonkies in those places too might not be the same but still wonkies.

  12. #12
    SitePoint Enthusiast devAngel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by molona View Post
    For the same reason they're so popular in Spain, I guess... they're flashy people... they're all up for the animation and the spectacular special effects...

    Problem is... third time they visit the site, they get bored and go for something more fashionable.

    True that's why I avoid flash if possible. People here in Philippines is also fond of flash. With the slow connection on some areas here, it will take forever to load a simple flash intro...not recommended.
    sig space open...

  13. #13
    Follow: @AlexDawsonUK silver trophybronze trophy AlexDawson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiberianHuskey View Post
    It's how some cultures think, a bit wonky if you ask me. I might add that North America and the UK are far from perfect there are wonkies in those places too might not be the same but still wonkies.
    I can back this up! I know plenty of people both here and in the states and they are indeed wonky! (Who said anything about using flash ) I do agree with Flash sites being like the fashion industry, most people wouldn't wear what is on a catwalk because it looks silly or would feel uncomfortable, but because it's in fashion it gets a status associated with it... therefore the same applies to Flash websites, for all it's downsides it really does offer a rich experience for those who can use it.

  14. #14
    Programming Since 1978 silver trophybronze trophy felgall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexDawson View Post
    for all it's downsides it really does offer a rich experience for those who can use it.
    And for all the sensible people there is the flashblock plugin (for Firefox or Opera) to get rid of it while still leaving flash available for the times you really need it.
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  15. #15
    SitePoint Wizard bronze trophy Tailslide's Avatar
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    Funny you mention this - I was looking for some campsites in France this summer and every single site I visited had some slow, elaborate, probably expensive flash thing going on. It was very tedious and irritating!
    Little Blue Plane Web Design
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  16. #16
    Follow: @AlexDawsonUK silver trophybronze trophy AlexDawson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by felgall View Post
    And for all the sensible people there is the flashblock plugin (for Firefox or Opera) to get rid of it while still leaving flash available for the times you really need it.
    I use NoScript, it locks all scripting unless I give it access rights (that includes Flash)

    Either way it's very interesting that Europian countries seem to be heavy on the Flash usage but less interested in accessibility and usability, I wonder if any statistics have ever been released as to the prelevence of this kind of design (country wide) as it might be cool to see their reasoning behind the choice.

  17. #17
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    European countries are amazed by Flash, while in North America they had to learn because people gave them this comment "the site is slow, I got tired and walked away" so because of that we sped it up while in Europe they want to present you with fireworks that is fine but do it so it's fast. Europe will learn, soon !

  18. #18
    SitePoint Wizard bronze trophy Tailslide's Avatar
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    Not all European countries - thankfully!!
    Little Blue Plane Web Design
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  19. #19
    Mazel tov! bronze trophy kohoutek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiberianHuskey View Post
    European countries are amazed by Flash, while in North America they had to learn because people gave them this comment "the site is slow, I got tired and walked away" so because of that we sped it up while in Europe they want to present you with fireworks that is fine but do it so it's fast. Europe will learn, soon !
    I've never heard about that. Do you have any reports/statistics on this?
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  20. #20
    SitePoint Wizard bronze trophy conradical's Avatar
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    Because it gives the French a reason to light up a cigarette while the movie loads.

  21. #21
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    Haha Conradical

  22. #22
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    hope u will be right....
    and i hope u will be get job easily.........


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