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  1. #126
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    well the link juice would of been nice, but hopefully i will continue to read quality info.. that alone will be worth the time visiting the forums.

  2. #127
    billycundiff{float:left;} silver trophybronze trophy RyanReese's Avatar
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    Dang I missed a lot. Pretty good thing yay I hope less spammers scome now.
    Always looking for web design/development work.
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  3. #128
    SitePoint Member gausarts's Avatar
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    I heard all dofollow dangers before, so go ahead. Socializing is not merely link building. I hope I can learn something valuable here.

  4. #129
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    I don't have a problem with this. Sure, there are links in my signature, but it's not because I wanted link juice. I already promote my site in different [legal] ways.

    On top of that, SitePoint itself is a great forum. I've socialized with cool people & I would take that over link juice any day.
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  5. #130
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    Why am I the only one being slated here. I have clearly stated I am not only here to bnenefit myself, I dont mind aiding, assisting and answering questions.

    I get a bit annoyed that its take take take from sites, im not asking for a big banner across the page and i dont spam this forum, all i ask is that i am rewarded a little for the time and effort in helping others.

    I cannot belive im on my own here, however I have a stack of customer documents that need to be delt with would anyone be willing to come in the office and give me a hand for free?

    Besides Matt Cutts has posted as of yesterday that nofollow forums will reduce their own page rank http://www.mattcutts.com/blog/pagera...ting/#comments

    "Matt, I’m sorry but allowing nofollowed links in blog comments to detract from the PageRank flowing within my site is absolutely moronic. Yes that was the way that it worked before the nofollow attribute but people also bought links without concern of the nofollow tag back then. Obviously things change."

    P.S On another note, Lets not lower the tone and have a personal dig at my intelligence at web/seo scripting.....!!!
    Last edited by Asset Finance; Jun 16, 2009 at 07:55. Reason: link

  6. #131
    Follow Me On Twitter: @djg gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy Dan Grossman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asset Finance View Post
    Besides Matt Cutts has posted as of yesterday that nofollow forums will reduce their own page rank http://www.mattcutts.com/blog/pagera...ting/#comments
    Good thing this isn't a nofollow forum then.

  7. #132
    SitePoint Wizard Stomme poes's Avatar
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    I get a bit annoyed that its take take take from sites, im not asking for a big banner across the page and i dont spam this forum, all i ask is that i am rewarded a little for the time and effort in helping others.
    But the point everyone is making is simply that, they only want people who give because they like to give, because in their opinion those are the best types of forumers.

    So there are people who give to charities because it's both a good thing AND you can write it off on your taxes,
    and then there are people who give to charities because it's a good thing and don't even bother reporting it to the tax authorities, because it doesn't occur to them, and if you mention the benefit, they shrug and say whatever, too much work. : )

  8. #133
    Programming Since 1978 silver trophybronze trophy felgall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asset Finance View Post
    all i ask is that i am rewarded a little for the time and effort in helping others.
    The only real reward that signatures give hasn't been affected by any of the changes. Real people can still follow those links where the help you provide them with gives them a reason to follow the links.

    Signature links have never had any value with the search engines of any significance and so hiding them from the search engines has no effect at all on the value of the signature (just on the perceived value by those who misunderstand how signatures work and spam forums thinking that their signature at the bottom of their spam will somehow help them).

    f anything, getting rid of more of the spam will improve the value of the forum and thus make the signature links more valuable with the real people visiting the forum.
    Stephen J Chapman

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  9. #134
    Word Painter silver trophy Shyflower's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stomme poes View Post
    But the point everyone is making is simply that, they only want people who give because they like to give, because in their opinion those are the best types of forumers.

    So there are people who give to charities because it's both a good thing AND you can write it off on your taxes,
    and then there are people who give to charities because it's a good thing and don't even bother reporting it to the tax authorities, because it doesn't occur to them, and if you mention the benefit, they shrug and say whatever, too much work. : )
    We have a log of fluff posts that is 158 pages long with over 3900 fluff posts. Many were removed because our members reported them. Worse yet, we lost several long-standing members because they grew tired of wading through the trash while trying to read through a discussion.

    It became a question of whether we wanted the two cents donations of link spammers or the substantial donations from those who are genuinely interested in helping to make SitePoint Forums the excellent webmaster resource that it is. I think SitePoint made the right choice.

    Moreover, I am eternally grateful that as a volunteer staff member I am not spending over an hour a day taking out the trash everyday. This is like a breath of fresh air and I, for one, am breathing deep.
    Linda Jenkinson
    "Say what you mean. Mean what you say. But don't say it mean." ~Unknown

  10. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shyflower View Post
    That's what community is all about!

    Thank you Admin!
    I dont have a lot of posts ..but I joined SP some 5 years ago and surely it has been a great help for me since then! Learnt a lot from here...

    Maybe increasing the limit from 100 posts to something like 500 or 1000 posts would have been a better option than outright disabling of forum sigs for non-logged users. Maybe..

  11. #136
    Programming Since 1978 silver trophybronze trophy felgall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by umairmasood View Post
    Maybe increasing the limit from 100 posts to something like 500 or 1000 posts would have been a better option than outright disabling of forum sigs for non-logged users. Maybe..
    Why would they do that when what they have done has the same effect and is easier to apply?
    Stephen J Chapman

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  12. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by felgall View Post
    Why would they do that when what they have done has the same effect and is easier to apply?
    rite... but yea even I'd have wanted my sig to be visible to the search engines. Anyways, I have no problem with the decision taken on this issue... I m happy either way.

    SP remains to be the most professionally maintained webmaster forum I know of... doesnt change that

  13. #138
    SitePoint Author silver trophybronze trophy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Asset Finance View Post
    I get a bit annoyed that its take take take from sites, im not asking for a big banner across the page and i dont spam this forum, all i ask is that i am rewarded a little for the time and effort in helping others.
    Remember that you haven't really lost anything by this change. Since your post count is below 100, your signature links were nofollow before the change. With your current posting rate, you wouldn't have had dofollow links until the 25 July.

    Quote Originally Posted by Asset Finance View Post
    I cannot belive im on my own here, however I have a stack of customer documents that need to be delt with would anyone be willing to come in the office and give me a hand for free?
    No, and we don't do people's chores here either. But we try to help and educate those who are willing to learn. And seeing them learn and grow is the reward we cherish. In the process we usually learn quite a lot ourselves, which is also a valuable reward.

    So someone might give you pointers – for free – on how to handle your paperwork efficiently, but you'd still have to do the actual job yourself.
    Birnam wood is come to Dunsinane

  14. #139
    SitePoint Addict Green Moon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by felgall View Post
    The only real reward that signatures give hasn't been affected by any of the changes. Real people can still follow those links where the help you provide them with gives them a reason to follow the links.
    WRONG!

    Ninety percent of the "real people" viewing this forum are "guests." Those are most likely people who have found a useful thread in the forum using a search engine and are reading your post. Guests are are not logged in and will never see a signature.

    When 90% of the real people who would have been able to read your signature can now no longer see it, saying "The only real reward that signatures give hasn't been affected by any of the changes" is simply untrue.

    I am fine with the change, but let's not pretend that there was no real change. Whatever benefit existed from real people seeing a signature is largely gone.

  15. #140
    SQL Consultant gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Green Moon View Post
    Whatever benefit existed from real people seeing a signature is largely gone.
    guests aren't real people, they are like bots

    real people register and take part

    rudy.ca | @rudydotca
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  16. #141
    Follow Me On Twitter: @djg gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy Dan Grossman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Green Moon View Post
    I am fine with the change, but let's not pretend that there was no real change. Whatever benefit existed from real people seeing a signature is largely gone.
    As I wrote a few pages ago, this isn't the first time SitePoint's had signatures turned off to guests.

    I got plenty of signature clicks back then.

    The real connections you make with other people (who become your friends, future business partners, people to refer work to and have work referred to you by, etc) require more than a passing visit to a forum post to read a single thread. They happen with other registered members, not the guests.

    Maybe you should try listing your design portfolio in your signature instead of toenail fungus cures, this being a web professional community and all.

    The real benefit is what you learn and who you meet by participating, not the signature clicks.

  17. #142
    SitePoint Addict Green Moon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Grossman View Post
    The real connections you make with other people (who become your friends, future business partners, people to refer work to and have work referred to you by, etc) require more than a passing visit to a forum post to read a single thread. They happen with other registered members, not the guests.
    I agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Grossman View Post
    Maybe you should try listing your design portfolio in your signature instead of toenail fungus cures, this being a web professional community and all.
    Actually, I am not a web professional, just a hobbyist who stops by to learn more. My websites for my real-life profession get about 10,000 visits a month and generate substantial new business for my professional practice. My business is not aimed at web professionals and I would not even consider posting my real-life websites in my SitePoint signature.

    The sites in my signature are simply an eclectic mix of very small sites that generate few clicks and even less income. But I will say that every month there are a couple of clicks from Sitepoint users (including clicks on my toenail fungus and toothache websites).

    Since I don't include my professional sites in my signature, hiding the signature from non-logged in viewers is not really an issue for me. I just feel that the issue of guests seeing signatures is being misstated by some of the arguments in this thread. I am not saying that links are important, or that they should be viewable by guests. I am simply saying that 90% of the people who could view them before cannot view them now. That is a material difference and to say that real people viewing the links has not been affected is simply not true. My nature forces me to comment when people state something as fact that is patently false.

  18. #143
    Programming Since 1978 silver trophybronze trophy felgall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Green Moon View Post
    I just feel that the issue of guests seeing signatures is being misstated by some of the arguments in this thread. I am not saying that links are important, or that they should be viewable by guests. I am simply saying that 90% of the people who could view them before cannot view them now. That is a material difference and to say that real people viewing the links has not been affected is simply not true. My nature forces me to comment when people state something as fact that is patently false.
    What you are stating is patently false. The 90% of people visitng the forum as guests are very unlikely to follow forum links anyway so the loss from their not seeing those links is negligible (it is a loss though so if that were the only factor then you'd be right).

    Getting rid of all the spammers from the forum means that the forum will be more useful to those who it is intended for meaning that the number of registered users should grow. These are the people most likely to follo0w relevant signature links anyway so as the number of registered users grows as a result of the reduction in spam the number of those following signature links should also grow (and by more than is lost through casual visitors not seeing the signatures).

    The overall result should be an increase in real people following relevant signature links.

    The important word in the whole discuaaion is "RELEVANT". If your signature links are not on a topic that is related to what the forum is about in the first place then the value of those links is minimal to zero regardless of who can and can't see them.
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  19. #144
    SitePoint Addict Green Moon's Avatar
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    @fegall

    Stephen, first, let me say I am sorry for using the words "patently false" in my post as that sounds like a personal attack and it wasn't intended as such. That, unfortunately, is the lawyer in me coming out.

    You are a valuable contributor here and are one of the main reasons I find this forum useful. I come here to learn, not to teach.

    When searching for specific answers on some issue involving CSS, PHP, HTML or any of the various topics that are foreign to me, search engines often lead me to forums where I read posts as a guest. Very rarely do I decide to register for the forum. Only after ending up here several times to read posts did I ever decide to register as a member of SitePoint.

    If I were a guest here and read one of your typically helpful posts and saw your signature links "Free Computer Help" or "JavaScript scripts and tutorials," I think I would be very likely to click on your links. Much more likely, in fact, than if I were an established member of the community who, like you, is most likely a knowledgeable web professional himself.

    Since you have signature links that are highly relevant to why most guests would end up here in the first place, it would be very interesting to compare the visits you get after the change to the visits you got before the change. I may be wrong, but I suspect that the number of visits you receive from SitePoint will be down significantly.

    Even if I am right, I don't argue that hiding the signatures is an unreasonable price to pay to stop the spammers. I hate spammers, too, and as I said before, my signature links are basically a joke, so personally I welcome the change. If it affects anyone, it's going to be the valuable contributors with relevant signature links like you. Time will tell.

  20. #145
    SitePoint Enthusiast ajcones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shyflower View Post
    That's what community is all about!

    Thank you Admin!
    Yeah, I agree. It's one of the reason why we're here and not only by aiming the backlinks. Alhtough some of us here will not agree on this new rule but it's the forum rule, so we must to accept this.

  21. #146
    SitePoint Wizard Stomme poes's Avatar
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    Green Moon--
    Even though I'm registered, I often read through things as a "guest". The way SitePoint forces you to register is the way they've disabled their Search function (not that I can ever get anything from it; it removes my most important search words every time, try "IE ignores padding table" to see an example) and plenty of other things you can't do, like see what else a person has posted (View All Posts) and any posted images (such as attachments in the quizzes) --actually, ANY attachments, are also not viewable. You have to be logged in.

    I assume this is to save the server(s), but it helps force those who have their eyeballs on a specific topic to register (and log in). Doing it via Google can also work but it's more hit-or-miss.

  22. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asset Finance View Post
    all i ask is that i am rewarded a little for the time and effort in helping others.


    Socializing with others, making new friends, etc. isn't enough? Damn.
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  23. #148
    billycundiff{float:left;} silver trophybronze trophy RyanReese's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asset Finance View Post
    I get a bit annoyed that its take take take from sites, im not asking for a big banner across the page and i dont spam this forum, all i ask is that i am rewarded a little for the time and effort in helping others.
    Sorry to jump in, I hope you don't mine ...
    But noone is ASKING you to contribute. This is an open forum and I dedicate many hours a day helping people, like about 8 hours a day...Not because I particularly LOVE it (I do) or I expect some reward. You want ot know why I answer questions?

    To keep on top of the game. Learn stuff. Be a good human being. Asking for something in return is selfish IMO. If you don't recognize this then why even be here? Noone is forcing you to come here. Noone will give you benefits for being here.

    Just a few pennies for thought.
    Always looking for web design/development work.
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  24. #149
    SitePoint Wizard siteguru's Avatar
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    No doubt this is reducing the amount of spam, but I guess it'll take a while for it to become apparent to the "fluffers".

    As such ... is there any reason why the nofollow wasn't also retained for members with low post counts?
    Ian Anderson
    www.siteguru.co.uk

  25. #150
    From Italy with love silver trophybronze trophy
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyanReese View Post
    This is an open forum and I dedicate many hours a day helping people, like about 8 hours a day...

    Ain't it time to get yourself a life?


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