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  1. #1
    SitePoint Guru risoknop's Avatar
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    Is it worth to learn JSP?

    I already know PHP very well and I'm thinking about learning another language? Is JSP worth learning right now? I have heard that it's in decline and number of websites that use it is shrinking.

    I also know C, C++ and C# on an average level so maybe learning .NET would be better idea?

  2. #2
    Follow: @AlexDawsonUK silver trophybronze trophy AlexDawson's Avatar
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    If you want a language which is high in demand and popular (alike PHP) ASP.NET would be a good choice, its a favorite among businesses as its closed source and provided by Microsoft, though there other languages out there which if you are interested in producing web applications which may be worth learning such as Python and Ruby. So really I would consider your options as it depends what kind of clients you want to attract.

  3. #3
    SitePoint Wizard
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    If you want high paid job then Java/.NET.

  4. #4
    SitePoint Guru risoknop's Avatar
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    Well what's more perspective - Java or .NET? I've heard Java is in decline, is that true?

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    Follow: @AlexDawsonUK silver trophybronze trophy AlexDawson's Avatar
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    It depends, languages do not tend to go "into decline", not in the traditional sense anyway, take a look at Perl, that thing has been around for eons and it still holds a niche audiance to this day who are dedicated to continue using it. Wherever there is a language there is an audiance.

  6. #6
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    My advice is to start learning more simple lanuages as php perl

    then shiwtch to Java .Net

  7. #7
    SitePoint Guru risoknop's Avatar
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    Well I already know PHP on a very good level (OOP, design patterns and all that). I also have some experience (mainly from college) with C, C++, C# and Assembly, so I think it is a time to move to a more complex language with which I can find a decend job once I finish the college.

  8. #8
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    I suggest you to go for .NET instead of Java. I am also a PHP programmer, I am doing the same i.e. learning Asp.NET. The best part is that your code is secure in .NET unlike PHP.

  9. #9
    Follow: @AlexDawsonUK silver trophybronze trophy AlexDawson's Avatar
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    risoknop, actually I would look up Python and see if it suits your needs, it does have a lot in common with the more console based languages and with the migration towards web apps is pretty in demand these days like ruby.

  10. #10
    SitePoint Wizard
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    Quote Originally Posted by risoknop View Post
    Well what's more perspective - Java or .NET? I've heard Java is in decline, is that true?
    Absolutely Not! Recently with Oracle purchasing SUN, you can rest assure what language Oracle will promote. Most likely, more project will be heading to Java if Oracle does good job in optimizing w/ Oracle DB. Of course, they can screw it up and Java will gone forever but chance of that is very small. In any case, Java will stay at a minimum for 10 years and most likely 20 more years on top of that. Also, switch from Java to .NET is very easy since they share 90% of the concept. For me, only way to learn .NET is when .NET salary is at least 30% higher than Java. Sadly for me, it's the money that drives me to learn which language.

  11. #11
    SitePoint Guru risoknop's Avatar
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    Thanks for responses, I'm currently leaning towards Java because I don't like the fact .NET has closed source. I will think about it a bit longer.

    Are there some good frameworks in Java similar to Zend or Symphony in PHP?

  12. #12
    Open Source Believer HunterWeb's Avatar
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    Well, I'll start off by saying I am not a full time programmer -- yet.

    However, similar to you, I just graduated school and I am exploring new career opportunities. In my case, I've jumped back and forth on which language to learn and whether or not to focus on being a desktop programmer or a server-side programmer for web applications. In my case, I settled on Java, and here is why:

    Java is clearly the most demanded language in my area. I've spent countless hours browsing wanted ads, talking to companies, interviewing, and so on. At least for the immediate areas around me, this is certainly the case. In that same spirit, Java is quite ubiquitous boasting use in everything from computers to cell phones to other devices and appliances.

    Java is where the jobs are at now, and as should always be thought of when dealing with IT, it will be where the jobs are in the future as well. It offers the unique chance to be both a desktop language as well as a server language. It is trusted, reliable, and established.

    That being said, ASP.NET certainly makes a very strong case as well. For me, though, I just couldn't pass up what Java offered; I'm learning more about both desktop and server applications, and from there I can find my path and figure out what I enjoy most.

    In your case, you have a background in this in school, which helps. In my case, I decided post-graduation that I wanted to program. I probably use this phrase too much, but glad to see you doing your research. Some very good thoughts and comments above, I definitely think the Oracle acquisition is important one way or another. The fact that you're talking Oracle, MySQL, and Java together suggests Oracle might be here to stay for the near term.
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  13. #13
    SitePoint Wizard
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyTech View Post
    Well, I'll start off by saying I am not a full time programmer -- yet.

    However, similar to you, I just graduated school and I am exploring new career opportunities. In my case, I've jumped back and forth on which language to learn and whether or not to focus on being a desktop programmer or a server-side programmer for web applications. In my case, I settled on Java, and here is why:

    Java is clearly the most demanded language in my area. I've spent countless hours browsing wanted ads, talking to companies, interviewing, and so on. At least for the immediate areas around me, this is certainly the case. In that same spirit, Java is quite ubiquitous boasting use in everything from computers to cell phones to other devices and appliances.

    Java is where the jobs are at now, and as should always be thought of when dealing with IT, it will be where the jobs are in the future as well. It offers the unique chance to be both a desktop language as well as a server language. It is trusted, reliable, and established.

    That being said, ASP.NET certainly makes a very strong case as well. For me, though, I just couldn't pass up what Java offered; I'm learning more about both desktop and server applications, and from there I can find my path and figure out what I enjoy most.

    In your case, you have a background in this in school, which helps. In my case, I decided post-graduation that I wanted to program. I probably use this phrase too much, but glad to see you doing your research. Some very good thoughts and comments above, I definitely think the Oracle acquisition is important one way or another. The fact that you're talking Oracle, MySQL, and Java together suggests Oracle might be here to stay for the near term.
    Yeah, I can definitely sense that IT jobs are hard to come by! I just recently got Masters in Computer Science and it really doesn't help much in finding higher $$$ jobs. About 99% of the postings require active TSI clearance!! jeez~~ G'luck!

  14. #14
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    I'm paid java codemonkey. PHP hobbyist.

    JSP is just a part of "java web", so its not very comparable to PHP in that sense. I for my part are only using JSP to boild together the html output ... like you would do in PHP. But the code to select/update to db, mess with data, do logic, make lists or maps, read this, do that, is pure java.

    There is a lot of java around, and it will be for many decades. You might not see a lot of java around you in day to day life. But they are used in many systems "behind the scenes". Banking, insurance, huge corporations, large whatever, are using A TON OF JAVA. A ton of websites use java, etc etc.

    Will there be an decline in java related jobs? Maybe, maybe not. Banks don't like to swap systems very often. They even today rely on COBOL (50y old language), so the jobs are dead safe. DEAD SAFE. TRULY DEAD SAFE. ITS FINANCE CRISIS SAFE.

    .Net have a bigger potentials since its used for desktop software too. So its quite a safe choice. But mostly it tries to compete for traditional java jobs.

    What to choose... I don't know. Java is for sure not a bad choice. If you like open source, you will find an extreme amount of libs and frameworks to your disposal. PHP has just barely started to get something that could be called "matured" framework like zend, cake etc. But Java got Struts, Spring, JSF that is 1000000times more mature. After all Java existed way before PHP.

    Java is also PAIN. The learning curve is steep, and it will take years until you get to touch many aspects of it. PHP is dead easy to learn compared.

    If you are going to take a java job, make sure they got experienced ppl that know what they are doing and are helpful. And hope you get to code something easy in the beginning. There is a lot of "just accept how it works, and hope you get pointers later that explain it to you". Its truly massive sometimes. But where else can you make twitter in just 1 hour?

    Don't be afraid of java - you can be filthy rich with it.

  15. #15
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    Java is the way to go i guess, I have been programming in java for the past 5 years now, it's evolved a lot since the time I looked at it first.

    The langauage is mature, though the learning curve could be longer then other.

    Regards,
    ROhit

  16. #16
    SitePoint Wizard rozner's Avatar
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    Will there be an decline in java related jobs? Maybe, maybe not. Banks don't like to swap systems very often. They even today rely on COBOL (50y old language), so the jobs are dead safe. DEAD SAFE. TRULY DEAD SAFE. ITS FINANCE CRISIS SAFE.
    I occassionally here these myths of Java being on the decline which is so far from the truth. Java is very much still in use and if you look at job sites like Monster there are a ton of Java listings. There are also many huge systems written in Java that will be around for a while. So companies using these systems will need Java devs for a long time to maintain them. Just like they still have Cobol and fortan people around supporting those legacy systems.

    .Net have a bigger potentials since its used for desktop software too.
    Java does desktop software too. Probably not as popular as .Net but Eclipse is a very good example, and there are plenty of Eclipse RCP projects that most people probably woudn't realise are written in Java.

    After all Java existed way before PHP.
    Not really... They were both developed in the 90s. Don't know the exact dates but I think around 95 for Java and 97 for PHP. But in terms of frameworks you're correct in saying that Java frameworks are far more mature. There are also a ton of open source libraries available.

    Anyway... Java will take you longer to learn but is well worth learning. It's also very easy to work in PHP if you already know Java.

  17. #17
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    I'm a senior CS undergrad student... Go with Java/JSP. Two good examples of existing systems that employ Java and JSP in some form are Bank of America and DopeStats

    The Java documentation is priceless, period. You waste a lot of time Googling around looking for code updates or the syntax of certain concepts in other programming languages. Plus you already know C#. Java is basically the same thing, possibly easier.
    drug abuse - www. dopestats .com


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