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  • oh noez

    3 5.36%
  • thank heavens , go php5!

    53 94.64%
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Thread: php4 is dead!

  1. #1
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    php4 is dead!

    thank god

    now shared hosts don't have an excuse anymore to drag their feet


    not that i care much by this stage i run my own tweaked/compiled/patched php5 versions on my own dedicated servers

    but i am happy that php4 will not get more security updates hence people will have to update whether they like it or not (unless they like being on unpatched servers)

  2. #2
    Theoretical Physics Student bronze trophy Jake Arkinstall's Avatar
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    PHP4 - RIP (For the benefit of all of us).
    Jake Arkinstall
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  3. #3
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    I doubt that many hosts even use php4 anymore.
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  4. #4
    Theoretical Physics Student bronze trophy Jake Arkinstall's Avatar
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    I thought so too - yet many people come to the forums specifying that they are using PHP4.

    I wonder, do they also use Windows 95? IE 4? Java Engine 1?
    Jake Arkinstall
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    Sometimes its enough to make that wheel more rounded"-Molona

  5. #5
    Programming Since 1978 silver trophybronze trophy felgall's Avatar
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    Some web hosting still offer the opportunity to choose between PHP4 and PHP5 so as to give people time to finish fixing any badly written scripts that they may have that don't run properly on PHP5. Presumably that option will be turned off soon since there has been plenty of time for people to fix their scripts and most shouldn't have needed fixing in the first place since properly written PHP 4 code also runs on PHP 5.

    Any host that doesn't currently offer PHP 5 at least as an option should be avoided as who knows what other services that they may be running that are also long past their use by date.
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  6. #6
    Floridiot joebert's Avatar
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    Doesn't Godaddy still have their default set to PHP4 ?
    Last time I did anything on a Godaddy site, which was maybe 6 months ago, the default was PHP4 and you had to setup the PHP5 handler & php5.ini via htaccess on your own.

  7. #7
    . shoooo... silver trophy logic_earth's Avatar
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    PHP 4 is not as dead as you think.
    http://www.php.net/archive/2008.php#id2008-08-07-1

    PHP 4 is still getting security fixes, and outstanding bug fixes. It just no longer receives support.
    Logic without the fatal effects.
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  8. #8
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    From the very article you referred to:
    This release wraps up all the outstanding patches for the PHP 4.4 series, and is therefore the last PHP 4.4 release.
    Until yesterday, PHP still got security and bug fixes.
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  9. #9
    SitePoint Wizard silver trophybronze trophy Cups's Avatar
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    So, PHP4 security and bug fixes stopped on 8 - 8 - 08.

    Is anyone taking bets on when PHP5 will suffer the same fate? I'd go with 10 - 10 - 10 just because it would be poetically fitting.

  10. #10
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    php4 was around since 2000, so by same standards it will take another 4 years or more to push php5 out of the way (thats if php6 ever gets done)

  11. #11
    Theoretical Physics Student bronze trophy Jake Arkinstall's Avatar
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    Felgall, Whilst I agree that people should have time to make fixes, they've had 4 years to do that (since PHP5 came out). The only reason PHP4 has continued is to allow people who's hosts won't budge to get more functionality.

    TBH it's about time that PHP started pushing for the future rather than dwelling on the past. Old versions are still around, functions are still procedural EVEN THOUGH PHP6 will have massive OOP power and use NameSpaces, too.

    Evidently people aren't willing to move because of backwards compatibility. If this is the case, maybe a branch of PHP should be created for people who like more control day-by-day, then the language will REALLY evolve.
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  12. #12
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    We just finished getting rid of PHP4 and on the day we removed it users were still specifically forcing PHP4 (we gave the option of 4 or 5). This is even when we sent notice after notice for the past year.

    It's not entirely all on the hosts here as there are actual sites out there that still need PHP4 in order to run!

    So a really damned if you do damned if you don't situation.
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  13. #13
    Theoretical Physics Student bronze trophy Jake Arkinstall's Avatar
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    Not at all.

    If every host upgrades, then developers will be FORCED to code to standards.
    Jake Arkinstall
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    Sometimes its enough to make that wheel more rounded"-Molona

  14. #14
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    I think that's key
    Quote Originally Posted by arkinstall
    If every host upgrades
    We know how much fun installations can be. I don't think it's any easier for hosts. Like the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" saying, confronted with upgrading or letting things ride, as long as ver.4 still "works", it takes incentive, such as demand, to force the issue. Does PHP 5 require more server resources than PHP 4? I doubt it. It seems to me that the improvements would be incentive enough to upgrade, but that's me.

  15. #15
    Programming Since 1978 silver trophybronze trophy felgall's Avatar
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    A lot of web hosts have had both PHP 4 and PHP 5 installed on their system for quite a while now. Obviously people couldn't upgrade their scripts to run on PHP 5 before their hosting gave them the option of running it that way (well they could test it on their own computer so as to be ready - as I did, not that anything needed changing since my code runs the same on both versions - but could not actually implement it before their host allowed it). I expect that when the various hosts introduced the ability to choose between PHP 4 and 5 they also announced that support for 4 would be soon discontinued (I know my hosting provider did). For anyone using one of the common open source scripts who don't produce the PHP themselves the scripts were already running on PHP 5 elsewhere and so were ready to switch over. For anyone writing their own scripts as arkinstall said they have had over 4 years to prepare. That only leaves those who purchased a custom script which doesn't support PHP 5 who might need to pay someone to fix it.

    For security reasons most hosting providers will soon turn PHP 4 off as an option. There will still be hosts around offering it for many years yet though. Earlier in the year I had someone purchase one of my scripts and couldn't get it to run properly on their hosting. It turned out that their hosting is still running PHP 3. Fortunately by deleting a couple of lines of code relating to a feature that the purchaser didn't need my script was also able to run there.
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  16. #16
    Theoretical Physics Student bronze trophy Jake Arkinstall's Avatar
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    PHP3? Ouch.

    Seriously, PHP should be like most current software. When not in use (or in low use) check for updates and update itself (of course, this could be set off in PHP.ini).
    Jake Arkinstall
    "Sometimes you don't need to reinvent the wheel;
    Sometimes its enough to make that wheel more rounded"-Molona

  17. #17
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    That's not possible. PHP runs on a such large variety of environments. Not only would the server become unusable during the upgrade, there's also the large risk of the upgrade failing.

    New (minors) versions of PHP also sometimes change the behavior of the engine/various functions without notice. An example would be glob(), where it started returning FALSE instead of an empty array.

  18. #18
    I &lt;3 Internet Tekime's Avatar
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    Hallelujah! I wish they did this a long time ago. It'll still be another year or two before I can fully drop PHP 4 support in my apps without losing a bunch of users.

    Zero "oh-noes" so far.

    Quote Originally Posted by arkinstall View Post
    PHP3? Ouch.

    Seriously, PHP should be like most current software. When not in use (or in low use) check for updates and update itself (of course, this could be set off in PHP.ini).
    I agree. The technology really has to get more intelligent though.

    Quote Originally Posted by sk89q View Post
    That's not possible. PHP runs on a such large variety of environments. Not only would the server become unusable during the upgrade, there's also the large risk of the upgrade failing.

    New (minors) versions of PHP also sometimes change the behavior of the engine/various functions without notice. An example would be glob(), where it started returning FALSE instead of an empty array.
    Unfortunately true, for now.
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  19. #19
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    I'm still running PHP4 (latest), because PHP5 will not installed on RH9 with old libXML. A newer version of libXML was not going to work.

    Yes, I'm still using old software / hardware and it works great.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by jkuiper View Post
    I'm still running PHP4 (latest), because PHP5 will not installed on RH9 with old libXML. A newer version of libXML was not going to work.

    Yes, I'm still using old software / hardware and it works great.
    ...until you get hacked or realize that your site will run faster under php5

  21. #21
    Programming Since 1978 silver trophybronze trophy felgall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jkuiper View Post
    I'm still running PHP4 (latest)

    There is no latest version of PHP4 any more, just as there is no latest version of PHP1. All versions of PHP prior to PHP5 are now obsolete and unsupported.
    Stephen J Chapman

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  22. #22
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    I think you guys would be surprised how hosts are responding to this. Most of the hosts I use still have 4 as the "core" php, but offer a cgi build of php5 to use. The answer I got was "The server can't run PHP 5 natively because it would break a number of things that the control panel and RedHat installs as the base OS did not come native with it."
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrandonK View Post
    I think you guys would be surprised how hosts are responding to this. Most of the hosts I use still have 4 as the "core" php, but offer a cgi build of php5 to use. The answer I got was "The server can't run PHP 5 natively because it would break a number of things that the control panel and RedHat installs as the base OS did not come native with it."
    thats the same line of thinking that leads to IE6 being still used widely

    despite better alternatives

    we all know how that ends up

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by ionix5891 View Post
    ...until you get hacked or realize that your site will run faster under php5
    If you can tell me how to install PHP5 without DOM and libXML, I'm gladly to install it. Because that's my main problem.

  25. #25
    . shoooo... silver trophy logic_earth's Avatar
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    http://www.sitepoint.com/forums/show...0&postcount=14

    If you ask me...you should update RedHat as well. Or pick a different distro.
    Logic without the fatal effects.
    All code snippets are licensed under WTFPL.



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