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  1. #1
    SitePoint Wizard
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    Last time I checked, polls were allowed so here goes one out of my highly-caffeined brain...

    Which Internet programming language do you primarily use, and why?


    As for me...
    ASP
    It's Microsoft-supported. Try calling [non-existant] Perl support through an 800 phone number. Nope? Microsoft gives phone support for ASP.
    Also, ASP is a commercial platform so as there are _many_ objects and components for it.

    How 'bout the rest of y'all?
    DietCokeGulp(Infinity())

    ------------------
    Think you're running the server "is 5" and an Asp is only a snake? Get with the times!
    Active Server Pages dominate.
    Soon to come: Aspology.com

    P.S.
    MS phone support is free!

    [This message has been edited by d3v (edited April 24, 2000).]

  2. #2
    SitePoint Wizard silver trophy Karl's Avatar
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    I use PHP for all the dynamic sites I have to do. I don't need (expensive) microsoft support becuase I can get it for free should I need it from a range of sites on the net (phpbuilder.com, zend.com, phpwizard.net).

    The reason I use PHP as opposed to ASP is becuase I have never seen a site that uses PHP not work becuase of a deficeincy of the language, yet I have seen several big sites not work due to ASP breaking or breaking the database connection (active-x.com - yesterday, dabs.com, my uni's server). ASP breaks to much for my liking.

    PHP is free, fast, effecient, supported and damn right good.

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    Karl Austin

  3. #3
    Destiny Manager Plebius's Avatar
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    I like perl for it's pattern matching and text manipulation abilities.. object oriented programming in perl is hideous though. My ideal language would be a cross between C++ and perl, with the better aspects of both.



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    Plebius Press - An independent media network

  4. #4
    RAGE
    SitePoint Community Guest
    PHP all da way baybee !

    perl is, simply put, ancient.. so, let me not argue that..

    asp, on the other hand, is half-decent, but windows isnt, like most microsoft products ..

    and to add to that, d3v, think if it this way, someday, you're sites will grow big and you'll get a d-server.. sure, you could afford the server, but when it comes time to look at the high amounts you'll be paying for the licenses, heh, have fun !

    as far as support, who needs it if you have good sites and properly prepared docs, like php has.. (cold fusion's support section isnt too shabby either.. does asp official online docs?)

    oh well... <skream>

    Kryogen WebHosting - proud to be 100% Microsoft Free

    ------------------
    Vinay Sahni (vinay@kryogen.com), Coder .. specializing in php/mysql
    ( Realmz ) ( ReviewDepot ) ( . . : : k r y o g e n : : . . )

  5. #5
    SitePoint Wizard westmich's Avatar
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    I would say HTML and JavaScript. Maybe a little CSS. I am still learning the basics of Perl, ASP, and Visual Basic.

    IMHO,
    Westmich

  6. #6
    SitePoint Addict
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    I use ASP but not because of free phone support never called never will

    As for online support and docs/articles there are much more ASP related sites than PHP. I'm not against PHP in any way. As for ASP errors I really dislike ASP error handling mechanisms (haven't checked news in this area in ASP3.0 yet). But as for problems on big sites I just haven't seen any big site build on PHP... yet

    Anyway ASP and PHP are great technologies and none of them is objectively better than other. Just the matter of taste.

    ------------------
    Alan Mendelevich aka ailon
    ArticleCentral.com - The content directory for web professionals.
    MEGOPhotos - Quality photos for FREE. UPDATED

  7. #7
    SitePoint Enthusiast Daniel's Avatar
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    C++. No question about it.

  8. #8
    SitePoint Wizard
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    C++...you mean Windows COM objects? Or a Internet program in Linux/*nix? I don't know many people who use C++ for Internet programmming...

    ------------------
    Think you're running the server "is 5" and an Asp is only a snake? Get with the times!
    Active Server Pages dominate.
    Soon to come: Aspology.com

  9. #9
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    As much as I like coding in Perl, PHP is the best language for web programming. I recently started learning it and have picked it up quickly because of the similiar syntax it has with Perl. As Luzer said, Perl is great for text manipulation and regexp's, but since it wasn't ceated for the web, it isn't the best for the web. PHP is so easy to integrate into your website, and the best choice if you plan on working with a database (MySQL in particular). Since PHP is free and open source, it is widely documented.
    I still plan to expand my knowledge on Perl (I recently purchased Perl Cookbook, excellent book btw) but that is basically just for interest.

    ------------------
    http://www.wiredstart.com The technology start page


    [This message has been edited by robp (edited April 30, 2000).]

  10. #10
    SitePoint Wizard silver trophy Karl's Avatar
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    ailon said

    <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote/font><HR>But as for problems on big sites I just haven't seen any big site build on PHP... yet<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Well i might like to add that WinAmp.com used to use until AOL took over, British Telecom use it, SitePoint uses it, PlusNet technologies (UK internet) use it and I could go on - and if you ask me SP is big and British Telecom certainly are.

    ------------------
    Karl Austin
    KDA Web Services

  11. #11
    SitePoint Wizard
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    I agree with Ailon. Sure, some large sites use PHP and I do like the language (it's just fun bashing it), but not many large corporations use it.

    ailon:
    But as for problems on big sites I just haven't seen any big site build on PHP... yet

    I'm sure as PHP gets more and more polished it will merge into the mainstream like ASP but as for now it certainly is not widely used by companies.

    ------------------
    Who the heck is Gen. Failure and why does he want to read my hard drive?
    Soon to come: Aspology.com

  12. #12
    SitePoint Wizard silver trophy Karl's Avatar
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    PHP is also used on the DVLA web site in the UK. A govermnet website no less.

    ------------------
    Karl Austin
    KDA Web Services

  13. #13
    SitePoint Wizard
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    Sure, PHP is used on some big sites...but then again ASP, if I remember correctly, is used on 60% of the Fortune 500 member's Web sites. PHP is good for personal use, and okay for business use (but the lack of professional PHP programmers turns many businesses down); however ASP is very scalable (from Access DBs to SQL Server 7.0) and is a big plus on programmer's resumes.

    ------------------
    Who the heck is Gen. Failure and why does he want to read my hard drive?
    Soon to come: Aspology.com

  14. #14
    RAGE
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    ya, as wluke pointed out a few weeks ago, most "businesses" are ms dependent, they use ms products all the time and they hire "MCSE" certified professionals, ... and duh, those guys use NT , and hence ASP

    If i was hired for a big company, I'd use a linux core, with MS workstations , and samba for file/print sharing, and webservers would all run linux/bsd

    ReviewDepot - search for hosts

  15. #15
    Your Lord and Master, Foamy gold trophy Hierophant's Avatar
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    Actually if you were hired for a big company you would use what the CTO and various committees told you to use and you would like it or be looking for a new job.

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    Wayne Luke
    SitePoint Moderator
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  16. #16
    SitePoint Member
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    People people!

    Calm down!

    Just in case you were asking, _yes_ php is used by FORD. It is free, faster than ASP, and has better database access than ASP.

    Does that make ASP uncool? No! Sometimes you just _have_ to use the vb support. Tech support? Hehe. Ever seen the mailing lists for PHP

    C++? Really cool. Use it if you have a super extra complex setup that you want to run tons faster than perl.

    Perl? Going by the wayside with PHP and ASP but it's still the most used one and it is really really useful. Arcane? Naaah. ASP and PHP are very very close to Perl in syntax.

    Cold Fusion? Well, I wouldn't plunk down my bucks if I were you.

    mysql? Not a language. It's a database. Mind you, one of the best mid-sized(Just a few million fields as opposed to billions) databases. Can be used with ASP, PHP, Perl, but PHP has built-in direct access.

    Javascript? It's a language used for client side scripting _or_ ASP. Usually compared to Vbscript(because it's the only competitor). Javascript kicks it all over the place.

  17. #17
    SitePoint Wizard
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    Perl was never meant for the Web. Instead of using &lt;%=Var%&gt; or &lt;?php echo $var ?&gt;, you have to use:

    #!/usr/bin/perl
    print "Content-type: text/html\n\n";
    print "&lt;html&gt;&lt;body&gt;$var&lt;/body&gt;&lt;/html&gt;";

    That's why I'm starting to boycott Perl for CGI use.

    Also, how dare you compare my language's (ASP) syntax to Perl

    The truth is that PHP and ASP were both made for the Web. ASP came out around 1996-97, and PHP/FI came out around 1995-96. Perl came out in the mid-late 80's.

    P.S. Now I have a lighter attitude towards PHP but I'm still not a convert

    ------------------
    Who the heck is Gen. Failure and why does he want to read my hard drive?
    Soon to come: Aspology.com

  18. #18
    SitePoint Addict
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    I've been switching technologies and specializations in the past 3 years. From "traditional" programming with c++ or vb to web programming with IntraBuilder, Netscape SSJS, Oracle's Application Server... More than year ago I decided that I need to come down and decide what field I want to asociate my professional life with. I've chosen ASP and now I feel much better cause 2 years ago my answer to the question "Could you do this with that?" was "I can't right now but I can learn fast" and now I answer "That is not my field of expertise". I believe that this way I can get strong experience in one thing so I know what job I'm searching for and why I'm good candidate. Much more comfortable than jumping from one side to another.

    P.S.: Quite hard to express my thoughts in not native language. Sorry if above statements aren't easy to understant

    ------------------
    Alan Mendelevich aka ailon
    ArticleCentral.com - The content directory for web professionals.
    MEGOPhotos - Quality photos for FREE. UPDATED

  19. #19
    SitePoint Zealot Tiger_Tom's Avatar
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    I like Perl. Lots of free scripts, not browser dependent. I had no previous programming experience or education, had a go at copying and pasting together my own script, and didn't find it too hard to pick up.

    Lots of tutorials and free code on the 'net.

    Haven't needed any real support. I did post
    a question in a VERY busy Perl Usenet group once. Got a useful reply.


    As regular readers know, I don't care to make William Gates any richer than he is, so I steer clear of MS products if I can.

    TigerTom 0~&gt; http://www.tigertom.com


  20. #20
    SitePoint Member
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    Tell me please why javascript and perl are so different? Sure you put a $ in front of vars, and some other stuff, but in all reality, they're both based on C..

    If you use vbscript, well, we woun't get into that

    Anyway, PHP and ASP are very similar, with PHP a bit more powerful and faster.

    Of course, PHP doesn't have the VB integration or the word processor/excel plugin capability, but all of that can be mimiced on A 'Nix system because PHP can run and operate any program(even windowed apps like GIMP)


  21. #21
    SitePoint Wizard
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    The syntax behind Javascript and Perl is very similar; however Perl is server-side and Javascript is (usually) client-side.

    I disagree that php is faster and more powerful. That's totally based on opinion, but then again your view is your opinion. The truth is that they are very similar except one is made by Microsoft.

    ASP can run and operate any program, too, so long as the program sends information through stdout (standard output), using (I think) the component WScript.Shell

    ------------------
    Who the heck is Gen. Failure and why does he want to read my hard drive?
    Soon to come: Aspology.com

  22. #22
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    I am sure many of you have already read this on slashdot, but I came across an interesting "Ask Slashdot" that relates to this discussion. the link is here.


    ------------------
    http://www.wiredstart.com The technology start page

  23. #23
    SitePoint Wizard
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    I think anyone who says that ASP is not powerful can quickly be proven wrong. One word: LoveBug.

    The LoveBug virus (see http://www.sitepoint.com/forums/Forum9/HTML/000256.html ) is written in VBA, a subset of Visual Basic, of which ASP is a subset (confused? same here ).

    ------------------
    Who the heck is Gen. Failure and why does he want to read my hard drive?
    Soon to come: Aspology.com

  24. #24
    SitePoint Member
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    I don't think you can say that ASP is better than PHP because 60% of fortune 500 companies use it as that is because probably something like 90% of them use NT as their operating system and asp is more commonly used on an NT system than PHP.

    I am only a beginner at PHP but so far it rocks! I can't wait to get into it more, but I'll have to wait till my exams are over.

    PHP seems to have a lot more features, and PHP4 will kick butt. PHP and mySQL are perfect fo each other.

    ------------------
    West Red
    http://trickynet.co.uk

  25. #25
    SitePoint Wizard
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    But they don't use NT for its ease, after all, they're the elite 500 which means they've got plenty 'o cash to spend on competent admins. They use NT because of its features, one of which is ASP.

    I do agree now that PHP is pretty cool (however not yet as up there on my charts as ASP is). It has natural connections with MySQL, while ASP is natural with any database. In asp the syntax is all the same (to add to different types of DBs) because ASP does the behind the scenes work for you. It's those little things that make ASP as great as it is.

    ------------------
    Who the heck is Gen. Failure and why does he want to read my hard drive?
    Soon to come: Aspology.com


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