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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Grossman View Post
    I don't think Symfony looks like RoR. It looks more like Struts I suppose.
    Hi Dan, it's true. Anyway, don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of Symfony as well. But they said it themselves, that they took the best of Mojavi and RoR. It uses the propel framework, phing instead of rake, similar design patterns and other stuff. Anyway, it's a great high-level framework, just like Django and RoR.

    Other PHP frameworks that were inspired by RoR: Akelos, Biscuit, Cake, CodeIgniter, PHP on Trax, TaniPHP and maybe others.

  2. #52
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    > I find that sticking to one thing very hard as the class unfolds all these methods keep
    > popping out at me

    This is where unit testing works best, as in a way it would prevent you from getting too far ahead of yourself in regards to the design. Personally, I'm not (yet) test infected but I would recommend you try it, if your not doing so already.

    On the point of Authentication, it is for the most part based around the Request and nothing more. If you can encapsulate the Request, then all you need to do is to apply one or more filters to the Request, and iterate over them.

    Once you do this, then query the Request for the existence of a given parameter and your done. The existence of this parameter would only be the case if the persistence layer proves to be true (ie, Sessions for example).

    PHP Code:
    $request -> addFilter( ... );
    $request -> addFilter( ... );
    $request -> process(); // iterate over array of filters, executing each filter in turn
    // ... later ...
    if( $request -> get'isauthenticated' ) ) { // ... yes 
    So, something like this would suffice? But there has bound to be a hundred different ways to implement this. Going by your script you posted, you really only need to have two public class methods, one for validating against a user id and one for username and password.

    Any form of encryption would be a separate concern, as there would be more than one methodology to that encryption; How you encrypt something shouldn't be open for public viewing anyways.

    Is error reporting essential? I don't believe so as in most cases than not, you would be performing a redirect anyways, so leave it to the application to alert the user of any errors; Certainly that isn't part of your framework

  3. #53
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    >There is just way too many variables that need to be considered, too much to be considered to use MVC as a basis for a framework.

    I just want to go back to this point you made earlier in the thread Dr.

    The reason I stated MVC was because I was pointed in that direction by reading this tutorial http://www.phpit.net/article/simple-mvc-php5/ I felt it kinda made sense to me and after re-reading and re-reading its helping me understand how the various parts flow together.

    Another thing I realised after reading one of your posts is that I was thinking about the "application" as the the framework and not the framework as a general foundation on which to build applications.

    So too conclude I'm gonna go ahead and build a small cms using the methods described in the above tutorial and not really care if its "proper" mvc or not.

    Only through experience can I really learn.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Livingston View Post
    > No, we have no plans to bundle ZF with PHP. – No, we have no plans to offer ZF under a
    > PEAR channel or other piece-by-piece distribution method.

    As far as I understand it, the Zend framework would be, or is bundled with PHP5 in this form,

    http://blogs.zend.com/tags/zend-studio-5.5-beta/

    > This version contains many new features such as: source control status decoration,
    > embedded Java code completion, Zend Framework integration, anti-alias support,
    > performance improvements and more.

    The blog post may be from late last year, but as far as I know, it still stands, as I do recall that there was an announcement that the framework would be made available for PHP5 for a number of parties, to be bundled.

    IBM in particular were stated to have their own interest in this regard. Obviously
    err that is the zend studio (a php editor) not the php binary.

  5. #55
    SitePoint Enthusiast willthiswork's Avatar
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    Sorry but Symfony creators never said they took the best from RoR.
    That was the quotation of someonelse.
    In fact Symfony borrows a lot from Struts without being that clunky.
    As regard with Mojavi, Symfony is built on it (not simply inspired).
    Now that much of the hype is fading away from RoR, it is time to make it clear:
    Symfony != RoR

  6. #56
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    Hi, I said that

    Quoet from the book and the on-line documentation:

    Back in 2003, Fabien spent some time inquiring about the existing open source development tools for web applications in PHP. He found that none fulfilled the previously described requirements. When PHP 5 was released, he decided that the available tools had reached a mature enough stage to be integrated into a full-featured framework. He subsequently spent a year developing the symfony core, basing his work on the Mojavi Model-View-Controller (MVC) framework, the Propel object-relational mapping (ORM), and the Ruby on Rails templating helpers.

  7. #57
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    Anyway, I'm not saying that because he said it. I think at this point we all know how much RoR influenced a lot of people, and also the way they work with frameworks. And if you never developed with Rails, you'll still find it familiar, and that's because other developers had ported, improved or implemented some of its ideas to PHP frameworks. Symfony was initially developed by Fabien, but has received a lot of contributions, and those contributions came from programmers that are not only programming in PHP, but also in Java, Ruby, Perl, Python, etc.

    I actually prefer Symfony over RoR, and PHP over Ruby. I like Ruby and also Rails, it's fun and challenging. But because I've used them before, I can compare them and determine what's best for me.


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