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  1. #1
    Non-Member FreelanceDesign's Avatar
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    Question How many people here are freelance PHP programmers?

    Do you work on your own site or are you a freelance programmer or a full-time programmer?

  2. #2
    Follow Me On Twitter: @djg gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy Dan Grossman's Avatar
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    Full time programmer during the day, work for myself after the job... in fall it'll be full time student during the day, work for myself after classes... then I have some important decisions to make, since I'll be graduating this coming year.

    My ideal will always be working for myself. I don't like when other people tell me what to do, even if they're paying me to do it.

  3. #3
    SitePoint Zealot t0WL337's Avatar
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    I just kind of work on my own site for fun. I have learnt a lot and people are starting to offer to pay me to do some minor things for them.

  4. #4
    SitePoint Enthusiast Chousho's Avatar
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    I'm finding that working on my own goals make for an enjoyable experience.
    Going to college and learning programming and concepts, as well as having an interest in furthering my skills for my own personal venture seem to go hand in hand, and help out many times.

    I don't think I would go freelance, or even work for a company yet until I get more of the logic down, and become more familiar with working with databases that are beyond mysql.

  5. #5
    SitePoint Wizard silver trophybronze trophy Cups's Avatar
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    I suppose you could say I am half-freelance. I do contract work part-time for a single organisation, part time for myself and spend the rest of the time learning. I work in a very specialized vertical market, and now turn away any work not in that market.

    For that one org I am only on-site once a month for a few days, and work mostly under my own steam. Typically, work on an idea, show them a preview and follow through only if they want it.

    I am lucky, it has worked for many years and allows me to live where I want to - not sure how for much longer though.

    Echoing Dan's sentiments really, I don't like being told what to do - and if what I am told to do I disagree with, then I find I am now unable to deal with it rationally - it potentially gives me a lot of stress - so I avoid situations like that. Working in a good team, properly led, I think I wouldn't have any problems, and in fact would really welcome that environment - from the few job feelers I have put out though this is not the prevailing case.

    You might say I am really lucky to be able to do what I want when I want, that is just cr*p - I have REALLY worked at it, and am always trying to make sure I have the skills for the next challenge. Part of the reason I am paid is that I am expected to "know" certain things, anyone in the organisation can ask me a question I can provide them with a pretty accurate snap shot of the truth - well, provide a regarded opinion anyway.

    Sometimes I think there is a blurry line separating freelancers, contractors and consultants.

  6. #6
    dooby dooby doo silver trophybronze trophy
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    work all day employed, work all night for myself and do freelance work as well - sleep is for wimps!
    Mike Swiffin - Community Team Advisor
    Only a woman can read between the lines of a one word answer.....

  7. #7
    phpLD Fanatic bronze trophy dvduval's Avatar
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    I don't do a lot of programming now, but I am working with programmers on a daily basis, and work at all different times of day, but I find time to do fun stuff too (besides phpLD).
    (ballroom dancing is my passion, but I like working on phpLD too)

  8. #8
    SitePoint Member
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    I work all day or go to school and develop with PHP for my own personal ventures at night.

  9. #9
    Caveat surfer Buddy Bradley's Avatar
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    Designer during the day, freelance PHP app developer in the evenings.

  10. #10
    SitePoint Wizard wheeler's Avatar
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    I was fortunate to start work in html/css and started learning programming through necessity for the employer. Unfortunately for the employer he is now more of a client, and I have dedicated most of my time to other endeavours with my new found skills!

    I have never worked under the direction of people who know more than me in web dev, so my learning is done virtually completely online. Probably why I hang out on SP so much :P

    I find freelancing a funny word because I guess in a sense I am freelancing, I am running my own business, not tied down to any particular client, and take on things here and there all the time...

    Like others mentioned, I enjoy being in charge. If I knew of a really awesome web dev company in my part of the world, I may well try and go for a job, but I think I prefer the uncapped potential of working for myself, building a business from square one, and running my own awesome company... complete with ps3 room, never ending beer fridge, and......
    Studiotime - Time Management for Web Developers
    to-do's, messages, invoicing, reporting - 30 day free trial!
    Thomas Multimedia Web Development

  11. #11
    SitePoint Wizard frank1's Avatar
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    ya it is same here initially when things started i use to have balanced work...but now it has been so many works that i cam unable to handle it....the so many works has been because of low cost for service in this part of world...

    i have left many project with in here in my country as i didnt have enough people who knows php
    i am thinking to train some now...
    after all developing good script has been all about team work now
    see phpbb

  12. #12
    phpLD Fanatic bronze trophy dvduval's Avatar
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    what country do you live in frank1?

  13. #13
    SitePoint Wizard bronze trophy Kailash Badu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dvduval
    what country do you live in frank1?
    He lives in the same country as I do.

    I have a dedicated subcontractor who runs a big offshore software development center in the US and who supplies the most of the development and consulting work. And there is a small network of clients who seek my service from time to time.

    In a different note, I have used your directory app a year or so ago and liked it. Glad to learn that you wrote it.

  14. #14
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    I am a full time employee and spend my free time studying (I'm a student, last year) and doing different projects for me.

    I see that much of you guys are full time employee and freelancing in your free time. I was wondering how many hours get to sleep each night, because working 8 hours as full time employee, another 6 hours freelancing plus different casual things is kind of exhausting.

  15. #15
    SitePoint Wizard frank1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kailash Badu View Post
    He lives in the same country as I do.

    I have a dedicated subcontractor who runs a big offshore software development center in the US and who supplies the most of the development and consulting work. And there is a small network of clients who seek my service from time to time.

    In a different note, I have used your directory app a year or so ago and liked it. Glad to learn that you wrote it.
    no hard feeling
    but i think it is my privacy and right to tell where i come from...any way never mind....i would have been g8ful if i was able to talk on my side...

    any way as i say no hard feeling....

    by the way is there any certification of php which is accepted internationally...?
    About mr badu ya these US people are coming here but we beleive that it is about 1-2% of total work that is even outsourced to asia...
    firstly they look for indians...and they look for low cost people here work for may be $50-$100 for a project ...and no hour basis system...
    internationally there are php pros who take 250$ per hours ..so it has been all about cost...we dont feel and think that in scale of skills we are behind...

  16. #16
    SitePoint Wizard bronze trophy Kailash Badu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frank1
    but i think it is my privacy and right to tell where i come from...any way never mind
    I should have thought twice.

    by the way is there any certification of php which is accepted internationally...?
    Zend Certification.

    I strongly feel that we actually are behind. Not only in terms of how we code but also in terms of how we market ourselves. Putting together a generic CMS is one thing building a secure, robust, enterprise-scale application is quite another. Most of the programmers I have seen are run-off-the-mill kind who write horrible code. They still have a long, long, long way to go before they can call themselves a Pro or can charge $250.

  17. #17
    Keep it simple, stupid! bokehman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kailash Badu View Post
    or can charge $250.
    That's pretty open ended. You speak as if $250 dollars were a lot of money but you don't say what it relates to. Personally I charge by the job, not by the time.

  18. #18
    SitePoint Enthusiast Chousho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bokehman View Post
    That's pretty open ended. You speak as if $250 dollars were a lot of money but you don't say what it relates to. Personally I charge by the job, not by the time.
    Well, for some people, such as myself, a poor college student, $250 is alot of money, even if its for a car or house. Even something worth 100 times the price you pay doesn't always mean the price isn't costly to the spender.

    Also, hurray for double contractions, but the point of the sentence remains, haha.

  19. #19
    phpLD Fanatic bronze trophy dvduval's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chousho View Post
    Well, for some people, such as myself, a poor college student, $250 is alot of money, even if its for a car or house. Even something worth 100 times the price you pay doesn't always mean the price isn't costly to the spender.

    Also, hurray for double contractions, but the point of the sentence remains, haha.
    I think there is room for all kinds of different budgets. I think over time people tend to grow in value. I have worked with some very talented college students who did superior work to people who do it full time for a living. I just think you have to always do quality work, and over time the value grows, regardless of what part of the world you are in, or whether you are a student or a full time programmer.

  20. #20
    Follow Me On Twitter: @djg gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy Dan Grossman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bokehman View Post
    That's pretty open ended. You speak as if $250 dollars were a lot of money but you don't say what it relates to. Personally I charge by the job, not by the time.
    $250 per hour is a lot for a single developer no matter how big or small the project and no matter how rich you personally are, boke.

  21. #21
    Keep it simple, stupid! bokehman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Grossman View Post
    $250 per hour is a lot for a single developer no matter how big or small the project
    I really don't think so, but so many people under value their trade that the low end of the price structure is dog eat dog. If you set your sights a bit higher though there is little competition and a lot of firms out there that believe they are getting a much better quality job just because its a bit dearer. Even when dealing with the general public it is surprising how much people are willing to pay for simple services. For example summer is just starting here and air conditioning units are selling like hot cakes. The fitting charge is €150 (+ 16% tax) for a 20 minute job. No one questions it, they just accept that's what it costs. And what cut does the fitter get? Probably €8/hour if he's lucky.

  22. #22
    SitePoint Guru
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    $250/hr? Where'd that number come from?

  23. #23
    phpLD Fanatic bronze trophy dvduval's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Selkirk View Post
    $250/hr? Where'd that number come from?
    Definitely a high number. People like this are few and far between. Usually, they are more business owner types, rather than individuals, but there are exceptions to that too.

    I think a range of $10-95/hour would cover 98% of programmers out there

  24. #24
    SitePoint Enthusiast Chousho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bokehman View Post
    I really don't think so, but so many people under value their trade that the low end of the price structure is dog eat dog. If you set your sights a bit higher though there is little competition and a lot of firms out there that believe they are getting a much better quality job just because its a bit dearer. Even when dealing with the general public it is surprising how much people are willing to pay for simple services. For example summer is just starting here and air conditioning units are selling like hot cakes. The fitting charge is 150 (+ 16% tax) for a 20 minute job. No one questions it, they just accept that's what it costs. And what cut does the fitter get? Probably 8/hour if he's lucky.
    I think there is a difference between 3 factors, though. What is the average going rate, what is your service actually worth, and what is the most that can be sucked out of the pockets of the people paying.

    While it's great to get good pay, I don't think it's good practice (at least morally) to charge the most you can just because you know the people are either good for the money or don't know any better. It's good to get good pay, but, personally, I couldn't do the old:
    "how much does this cost?"
    "how much do ya got?"

  25. #25
    SitePoint Wizard bronze trophy Kailash Badu's Avatar
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    $250/hr for every day software development work is an awful lot of money. I don't see how you couldn't relate it to a context by reading the previous post. The context is general software development (not the occasional rush jobs or urgent troubleshooting assignments).


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