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  1. #1
    Non-Member crunchi's Avatar
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    patent registering

    Hello, i need someone who can tell me something more about patents and how to register one,.. I would like to register one before i start this page..
    I'm a bit confused so i need help of more educated people..
    What does it mean if you register patent in only one country/continent, does that mean that in other countries people are free to use your invention?
    What are the aprox. prices and time until these patents gets official..?
    What if somebody uses your idea, can you sue him and ask the money he mad e of it if you're owner of patent?

    tnx for answers
    and
    regards,
    crunchi

  2. #2
    busy Steelsun's Avatar
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    Better talk to a Patent lawyer.
    Patents are Expensive and Time Consuming to get, even if you try to do it on your own without an attorney.
    Brian Poirier
    SunStockPhoto: Stock Photos, Fine Art Photos, Event Photography

  3. #3
    Non-Member demosfen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by crunchi
    What are the aprox. prices and time until these patents gets official..?
    From what I've read, you should be ready to spend a low 5-digit sum. Obviously it's not for everyone. If it's not worth it for you, see if you can find alternative ways of protecting your idea.

  4. #4
    Non-Member crunchi's Avatar
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    well i don't really need something that expensive, but i would really like to protect my ideas from someone else..
    i'm really concerned about that, if someone with more marketing funds or allready established site borrows my idea and get some real money and i can just fall down angry..

    BTW: i thought prices are under $500 for simple idea's protection

    regards

  5. #5
    Visit docquesting.com docquesting's Avatar
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    I think you mean copy right research the us gov site for copyright protection. That is what can be copyrighted and what needs to be patented. Copyrights are under $100 and patents are over $5,000 for a legit lawyer.

  6. #6
    Non-Member demosfen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by crunchi
    i thought prices are under $500 for simple idea's protection
    I don't think you can protect ideas. Can you give a clue what exactly you want to protect?

  7. #7
    Visit docquesting.com docquesting's Avatar
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    If you dont know that you can protect ideas ^ you have no biz even posting or trying to help in this thread. Please do your research first or know something about the subject.

    Here is the proper url. You will want to read it through throughly. It says what you can and cant copy right. http://www.copyright.gov/

    Here is the patent and trademark office site. http://www.uspto.gov/ Do a lot of research first and make sure if you need to hire a lawyer get a reputable one that has previous experiance and not just any site online. Remember cheap isnt always better.

    Edit. And for goodness sake dont go and tell anyone what your trying to protect. Even if the act like they are trying to help you.

  8. #8
    Non-Member demosfen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by docquesting
    If you dont know that you can protect ideas ^ you have no biz even posting or trying to help in this thread. Please do your research first or know something about the subject.
    Thanks for the warm words. I followed your advice and did some googling. Here is the result

    http://www.ipwatchdog.com/protect_idea.html

    Unfortunately, despite what you may have heard, there is absolutely no way to protect an idea through intellectual property law. Copyright protects expression and patent law protects inventions, and neither protect ideas.

  9. #9
    King of Paralysis by Analysis bronze trophy
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    Quote Originally Posted by demosfen
    Unfortunately, despite what you may have heard, there is absolutely no way to protect an idea through intellectual property law. Copyright protects expression and patent law protects inventions, and neither protect ideas.
    Have you seen the patents that are granted? There are people/companies out there with patents on the hyperlink and the concept of storing customer data so they don't have to enter it each time they buy something online (Amazon).

    A process can be patented, and that is nothing more than a series of ideas.

  10. #10
    Non-Member demosfen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tke71709
    There are people/companies out there with patents on the hyperlink and the concept of storing customer data so they don't have to enter it each time they buy something online (Amazon).
    There is a lot of patents issued for things that cannot be legally protected. The patent office is doing sloppy job screening applications, or maybe they are more interested in collecting fees. I don't know what's the story here.
    There are hundreds of thousands of websites that utilize the Amazon's patent you just described. Maybe 1 out of 5 sitepointers has one. I have two myself, never heard from Amazon. If this sort of patent could be enforced, things would get ugly quick. (I read here on Sitepoint that there is a patent for 1's and 0's or something, don't remember the details.)
    Since ideas cannot be protected by patents, I don't see how a patent for an idea is of any use.

  11. #11
    Non-Member crunchi's Avatar
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    tnx everyone for answers..

    but i really haven't noticed anywhere if there is any way to secure myself?

    regards

  12. #12
    Non-Member demosfen's Avatar
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    I think you should just do it, and do it well. If you are agressive and innovative, by the time somebody copies you hopefully you will be far ahead. Think about Paypal - they couldn't prevent Ebay from copying their idea, but by the time Ebay entered market they were so far ahead that eventually Ebay just bought them out

  13. #13
    Non-Member crunchi's Avatar
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    see the problem is that there is allready a lot of sites with thousands of users using their services and they could easily stole my idea and use with their users database when i will have to build users community at first..

    regards

  14. #14
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    The problem is, no "idea" can be protected.

    Copyright protects your programs, patents protects your processes. If you want, you can "desgin a process" over your idea and hope to protect your idea too.

    But then again, such a patent is "weak" and if you don't do a proper "prior art" research you are throwing away your money. On the other hand if you have a LOT of money and lawyers, you might proceed and hope to get some money in the future.

    And yes, there are patents for the most basic software functions, like:

    when you open a window on screen, storing the background so that you can restore it when it's closed
    http://lpf.ai.mit.edu/Links/prep.ai....t.announcement

    Drawing a 3d object in 2d
    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/11...os_3d_lawsuit/

    reccomending "related goods" to customers based on their purchase history
    http://www.internetnews.com/ec-news/article.php/3432211

    "System and method for providing reservations for restroom use" (IBM patent 6,329,919)
    Think again when you cue for a pee, you might get sued.....

    The use of graphical and textual information on a video screen to sell products, aka e-commerce (for more related absurd patents, see http://www.chillingeffects.org/ecom/ )

  15. #15
    Non-Member demosfen's Avatar
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    You said there is a lot of sites in that niche. Perhaps it would be possible to code your idea and offer it to these sites as a package for less than it would cost them to write it from scratch?

  16. #16
    SitePoint Wizard silver trophy
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    Patents are awarded to novel and unique business methods, but not to ideas. Unfortunately this has been stretched in the past allowing smart companies to patent things like one-click checkouts and what have you. Of course a patent alone is not the end all be all, patents that should not have been issued can and are routinely struck down by the courts -- which is why you see most cases over seemingly silly patents settled outside of court in a way that both parties like.

    Going back to your original question, you would definitely need to speak to a patent attorney, if your serious about the idea and if you have the funds to go through with the process. Patents tend to cost thousands and thousands of dollars in research, filing and protection. This is not to say they can't be done for cheaper but when you're talking about patenting a business process, you better be sure it's done right (no refunds if it isn't).

    And just to reiterate, a patent can't protect an idea or something that is just the next step in a logical evolution. You aren't going to be able to patent having a forum for discussing the y3k bug, even if it's the first one -- forums aren't unique, it's just a new spin on one. But again, if you think you've got something that is a process and not just a concept, talk to an attorney.
    - Ted S

  17. #17
    King of Paralysis by Analysis bronze trophy
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    Quote Originally Posted by demosfen
    There is a lot of patents issued for things that cannot be legally protected. The patent office is doing sloppy job screening applications, or maybe they are more interested in collecting fees. I don't know what's the story here.
    I agree with you here.

    But court battles are still costly, and people with patents generally have deep pockets.


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