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  1. #51
    SitePoint Addict AllClicks Robert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fahd
    I've never clicked a pop up/under ad in my life even if it was something I found interesting. Banners and text ads on the other hand, I'll click if it interests me.
    The opposite is true with the general surfing public however.

    Pops generally get clicked on at a rate 10x or more that of banners. (Hence the reason they cost approximately 10x as much.)
    - Claxon Media - CPM banners/leaders/skys/squares
    Net 15 payments via Check, bank wire, or Paypal

    - PopUpTraffic.com - The original pop program. $3 to $4 CPMs

  2. #52
    If it aint Dutch it aint much Kilroy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlogPatrol
    Kilroy, I think you bring up an interesting point on type of site: content-based, look-up based, etc.

    Do you think it would be accurate to think of sites like BlogPatrol as 'service-based'? I'm thinking that BlogPatrol is kind of a hybrid between content-based (the site statistics) and the look-up (users return frequently to look up their own ever-changing content, i.e., the stats).

    If BlogPatrol is a hybrid, then I wonder what recommendations you would have for running pop-ads or not?
    Looking at BlogPatrol, yes I do think it may be a hybrid. It's not a true content website (think http://cnn.com, http://alistapart.com, http://wired.com as examples) and neither is it a look-up website (think http://wikipedia.org, http://howstuffworks.com and http://interglot.com).

    I agree with naming BlogPatrol a service-based website. With these kind of websites, it's a tough choice whether or not to "pop". If you pop too heavily, users may get thoroughly annoyed and choose to stop using the website. However, if you use your pops wisely and show only one at a time and sometimes skip visits visitors may not feel too bad about them.

    What it comes to down is the website value/pop annoyance ratio. Make them value the website more than they hate the pops.

  3. #53
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    Not to POP , or another word , no advertiser can POP any more !! SP2 and new Windows Vista will not allow that by default !!

  4. #54
    SitePoint Addict AllClicks Robert's Avatar
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    P.H.P.,

    Pops are working just fine.

    I suggest you visit any of the sites listed above with SP2, Vista, SP1, SP Pi, or Kadoogle and they will pop just fine.

    Most web publishers are smart enough not to let Microsoft decide which type of ad methods they can use on their websites.
    - Claxon Media - CPM banners/leaders/skys/squares
    Net 15 payments via Check, bank wire, or Paypal

    - PopUpTraffic.com - The original pop program. $3 to $4 CPMs

  5. #55
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    I am considering using pop-unders for my site - however I will restrict it to the pages which are hit with search engine traffic with visitors that are only looking for that specific page and then will close the window. For the main content base of the site, I think I will continue to have that popup free and hopefully make it with contextual and affiliate ads.

  6. #56
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    To pop or not to pop

    People hate pop adds. They are like a nag that just won't leave you alone. The more they agravate- the less you want the product/service. Pop up add blockers are the ones making the money now.

  7. #57
    Serial Publisher silver trophy aspen's Avatar
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    Yes... pop up blockers make money because... how does the "give-it-away" business model work again?
    Chris Beasley - I publish content and ecommerce sites.
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  8. #58
    SitePoint Evangelist Azam.net's Avatar
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    Does anybody know of a pop-up script that will bypass pop-up blockers please?
    Azam Marketing, Inc.
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  9. #59
    SitePoint Enthusiast BlogPatrol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheeky
    I am considering using pop-unders for my site - however I will restrict it to the pages which are hit with search engine traffic with visitors that are only looking for that specific page and then will close the window. For the main content base of the site, I think I will continue to have that popup free and hopefully make it with contextual and affiliate ads.
    Cheeky, I think your approach reflects a good balance!
    BlogPatrol.com - Free Blog Counters, Widgets and Stats
    Sign up | Demo | The Patrol Blog | Contact Us

  10. #60
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    I have many sites. Some of them have popups-popunders and invue, some of them have activeX (yes I'm evil but with rates way above $10 CPM ..) and some of them are completely popup/activeX free, just banners and text links.

    I don't remind having had a complain ever.
    Traffic has never decreased, on the contrary.
    I get good feedback telling me the sites are great.

    I have 2 sites with a mix of popups, invue, skyscrapers, banners, rectangles, text links, all on the same pages.

    So basically, content is surrounded by lots of ads.

    Ad companies tell me that they like my traffic and to send more clicks to them. So visitors do click on ads and make purchases.

    And guess what, people come back. Why ? Content that they don't get anywhere else.
    www.aliassoftware.com : a great search and replace program to maintain/updates all your sites pages, ads codes, search boxes ...

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by AllClicks Robert
    Most web publishers are smart enough not to let Microsoft decide which type of ad methods they can use on their websites.
    And most web users are smart enough block ads in one way or another, and not let scummy web publishers who don't give a damn about their customers pull the tired, old line of "well, it's not faaa-a-a-a-a-air!".

    By looking for "ways around it", you're only making it worse for yourselves. Why? Because the only "sure-fire" method of blocking popups will eventually be blocking ad-servers. And THEN what will you do? You won't have a ActiveX option, you won't have a banner option, you won't have a popup option. And you'll be left with Google adsense, or not publishing anything at all.

    People don't like popup ads. You really can't contest that. Sure, they might generate more, but the bottom line is that they annoy people in general. If you don't think that's a big deal, then how come the percentage of people with popup blockers went up so much (not counting SP2 blocking)? You're only driving people to want to block ads, instead of applying a little moderation. Originally, I did believe that it was unfair to web publishers to block ads, but after coming to this site, I see that it really isn't, because you don't care about the people who surf to your sites.

    One thing's for sure - FireFox is picking up steam, and you advertisers are a big reason why (what with those DirectX scripts)... and remember that in FireFox, we don't block code, or instances, or anything else, we can block things on the domain level, which means no DoubleClick, no Casale, no PointRoll, no NOTHING. And it doesn't just "not show" the ad, it actually prevents it from loading. All 100 million+ of us easily have this capability.

    I doubt FireFox will ever top IE, but Microsoft isn't stupid - they're moving towards restricting the browser loopholes you adverspammers use. And when the day comes that nobody sees your ads because of Microsoft, Google toolbar, Norton, and Firefox, please don't complain - after all, those popups you used to run were worth 10x what the text ones were, so you had your chance!

  12. #62
    SitePoint Enthusiast
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    I hate advertisement on Television (but I keep on watching it).

    Do you have an ad blocker for that ?

    Ads will never disappear of the Internet or it will be the end of it. Period.
    www.aliassoftware.com : a great search and replace program to maintain/updates all your sites pages, ads codes, search boxes ...

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by gallery
    I hate advertisement on Television (but I keep on watching it).

    Do you have an ad blocker for that ?

    Ads will never disappear of the Internet or it will be the end of it. Period.
    Actually, I do have an ad-blocker for my TV. It's called commercial advance, and it skips commercials without me even having to push a button. It's really handy - I haven't seen a single commercial since I hooked it up.

    And FYI, the "internet" existed long before advertising, and could easily survive without it. In fact, it would probably never miss a beat. Think about it - the really helpful or useful sites out there utilize NO popups, few utilize banner ads, and many have no ads at all.

    The internet is all about the communication. Advertising is all about disrupting what people are doing to force them to pay attention to something else.

  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by hoqensihy
    Actually, I do have an ad-blocker for my TV. It's called commercial advance, and it skips commercials without me even having to push a button. It's really handy - I haven't seen a single commercial since I hooked it up.

    And FYI, the "internet" existed long before advertising, and could easily survive without it. In fact, it would probably never miss a beat. Think about it - the really helpful or useful sites out there utilize NO popups, few utilize banner ads, and many have no ads at all.

    The internet is all about the communication. Advertising is all about disrupting what people are doing to force them to pay attention to something else.
    Yes, advertisements may be annoying and probably about 90% are useless to you. But to support a capitalist economy, we have to have ads.

    As more and more people that buy those TV ad blockers or download tv eps onto their iPod, it becomes a waste of money for companies to advertise in designated ad blocks. More and more TV shows like Queer Eye and Sex and the City, which are littered with subliminal (and sometimes not so subliminal) product advertising, will appear.

    No matter what you try to do, they will always find a way of bringing the ads to you. Advertising is all about making money, you know... to stop business from going bankrupt, and to keep you employed.

    But getting back on topic, if your main target are "hit and run" visitors that arn't likely to come back I think popup ads are a good solution in moderation, especially if the site is more gallery than article based, in which case contextual ads are less likely to work. If someone leaves my site just because of popup ads (im talking standard popups or pop unders, not activeX), either the information they didn't want the information, or their just leeches.

  15. #65
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    Arrow

    From a user's prospective, any type of forced intrusion into their surfing, or one which could cause system instability is extremely annoying. Just keep that in mind when your using popup/under ads for your website. It's no accident that every toolbar comes with popup blockers and now are integrated into most web browsers like I.E. and Firefox.
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  16. #66
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    popup advertisements just ended because nobody liked it.

  17. #67
    SitePoint Enthusiast JebBob's Avatar
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    Popups are annoying and should be avoided. Also the sliding ads which I see frequently are also annoying. People usually just click them out. Pop-unders are OK since if the visitor closes your site the pop under is a later reminder to join your newsletter or buy your ebook.
    ScammerNation.com-The Latest Scams Revealed! Don't get scammed.

    Buying a website? Read this article before you spend your money.

  18. #68
    SitePoint Addict shaxs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ulchie
    If you have a website where you get visitors once, and you never expect them to come back to your site, then pop as many ads as possible.

    If you want visitors to come back to your site, then don't pop any or do what sitepoint does. (Delete all cookies and refresh sitepoint, you'll understand what I mean.)
    That little banner that pops up on the bottom, I find that a non-obtrusive or annoying ad style. What are those called? Who offers ad's like those?

  19. #69
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    hmmm $10 cpm for popups ay? Would you mind telling us where? I may take a trip to the dark side

  20. #70
    SitePoint Addict dotancohen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlogPatrol
    PopUpTraffic.com has very high payout rates, but I haven't yet found the same level of controls. Also, when I briefly experimented with their ads, I found that the pop under ad took long enough to load that it caused me to wonder what kind of script might have been installed on my computer. (I got spooked and removed the ad script right away.) I'm planning to do some further test runs on one of my smaller sites to look more closely at what goes on when the pops are served (will post any results I find).
    Are you on Windows? I don't want to start a flame war, or to take this thread off topic, but didn't you just convince yourself to dump Windows?

    Would you mind if I quote you and start a new topic on this?

    Dotan Cohen
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  21. #71
    SitePoint Enthusiast BlogPatrol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dotancohen
    Are you on Windows? I don't want to start a flame war, or to take this thread off topic, but didn't you just convince yourself to dump Windows?

    Would you mind if I quote you and start a new topic on this? Dotan Cohen
    Hi dotancohen,

    It's not that I've given up pop under windows, it's just that I'm still searching for that ideal balance of minimal annoyance for visitors, reliable frequency capping, trustworthiness of serving non-spy/non-adware windows, and high payouts for publishers.

    I suppose that I'm conceding that, in order to keep my service free for BlogPatrol users, I have to serve some level of pop under windows until I find better ad publishing opportunities that help to pay for the lease and support of three dedicated servers.

    I'm currently doing test campaigns using Pop Unders by CasaleMedia on some pages and FastClick on other pages. (I'm working on giving TribalFusion a try too, but it's a bit of work getting set up with them.) The performance seems to be pretty good, but I feel that it's still early to tell anything definitive. (At least I’m not seeing those scare ‘mini-windows’ that seem to be loading/downloading without any content at all.)

    I definitely encourage more discussion to find out how best to serve ads that do not propagate adware or spyware. It still scares me that I’m relying on ad networks to help guard against advertising that installs any kind of malware on visitors’ systems. I look forward to reading about how we can provide safer advertising while still keeping the cash flow in the positive.
    BlogPatrol.com - Free Blog Counters, Widgets and Stats
    Sign up | Demo | The Patrol Blog | Contact Us

  22. #72
    SitePoint Enthusiast JebBob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ulchie
    popunders suck! I don't think many people ever look at them, and if your site has lots of return visitors, it just gets annoying...and can drive them away if its relentless.
    Popunders are certainly much better the popups. Popunders do work.
    ScammerNation.com-The Latest Scams Revealed! Don't get scammed.

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  23. #73
    SitePoint Enthusiast mcstang's Avatar
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    popuptraffic and paypopup are complete scams.
    As I have said numerous times before.. its very easy to promise $5 cpm When you only count 1/10 pops.
    What both of those sites are doing is along the lines of robbery.
    I believe some small company called standard internet owns them, but I did hear good thing about them, which is why I tryed them out.
    Get this:
    With my current network, I was getting 50-60$ a day from pops.
    When I switched to paypopup, I got 8$ a day, give or take.
    With popuptraffic.com I was lucky to see 5$.
    My impressions were counted 80% less than on my current network.
    Take it for what its worth. This is my personal experience with both networks. I do not feel like arguing it with the networks, since I am sure there is some "statistical" reason why I get paid 1/10th of what I did on another network, But I dont care. Less money is less money, and I will take my current provider with 1$ cpm over there networks 5$cpm any day of the week
    Krazy Karls Krazy Kontraptions

  24. #74
    SitePoint Addict AllClicks Robert's Avatar
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    bostondan,

    Before making false, obnoxious, and damaging statements, perhaps you should have some general knowledge as to how PopUpTraffic works.

    The program pays for a impression from every unique visitor in a 12 hour period. It does not pay on raw pops.

    This is clearly stated in the programs terms, which you apparently did not read prior to your rant.

    If you have better results with another program that's perfectly fine. But better results with another program do not mean that our program is a "scam."
    - Claxon Media - CPM banners/leaders/skys/squares
    Net 15 payments via Check, bank wire, or Paypal

    - PopUpTraffic.com - The original pop program. $3 to $4 CPMs

  25. #75
    SitePoint Enthusiast mcstang's Avatar
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    My comments are not false or obnoxious, while they may be damaging is the networks fault. I am simply stating my EXPERIENCE with the service.
    Im not saying its a horrible program, I am just saying it minimized my revenue 10 fold IN MY CASE.
    If it works for other people, thats great. I am just sharing my experience with others, which is my right.
    Krazy Karls Krazy Kontraptions


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