newbie question about showing websites to clients

[johnn]

Hi,

I just want to know, after completing a website and ready to show it to a client, is it ok to show it online? I'm thinking about letting the client typing in a password that I provided to enter a special area so that he can view the new site (This new site I will upload it and add it to my current site temporary). Is this a good way to do? Any problem?

Thanks in advance,
John

[Fluffykins]

My solution, although it's not currently implemented into the new version of the site was to create a client's login system allowing clients to log-in, post questions to their project leader, view mockups of their site and also view a log which I keep of how their site is progressing. That way, at any point, beginning, middle or end, they can log-in and see their own site. A secure area is certainly the way to go, plus by viewing it online they can test things like forms, links etc.

Ady

[johnn]

I'm curious and just want to know if I do that, a not-very-good client may download the new site and steal it and he doesn't have to pay me in full. Does it ever happen to you?
How do you prevent that from happening?

Thanks in advance.
John

[Jeremy W.]

Copyright. If he steals it, sue his ****.

[michaelwheaton]

Before you do any work at all you should have a 50% deposit. This is not an unreasonable thing to ask for and shows that both you and the client are serious about what you are doing. Also, they should have signed some type of contract, even if it is very short. Worst case scenario this way is that they steal it, but you still get some money and evidence to use in court if you have to.

[Fluffykins]

A clear terms of service is the key here. As Micheal said a deposit is also useful, though we only ask for 10% upfront which is non-refundable.

If your TOS states that until payment is received in full the website belongs to your company, and only when payment is received does the site's ownership transfer over the the client you should be ok. Make sure the client reads and signs the TOS before you start work on the project and if they do decide to try something naughty they've not a leg to stand on.

Ady

[Technosailor]

I agree about copyright, about intial deposits, etc., but don't get into the mentality that all your clients are crooks. You need to give your clients the benefit of the doubt. Treat them like kings and queens but don't let them take advantage of you. Do cart-wheels for them. Like I said in another post, it helps advertise you to other potential clients when one of youre customers raves about you.

I personally, do some work and typically set up milestones where at each milestone, I upload all my files to a secure portion of my website for clients to look at. I use server-side password protection and only the contact of the client gets the info. From there, the contact can let anyone he or she wants see it but by then, the balls in his court.

HTH.
Sketch

[johnn]

Thanks all.
If I ask for 50% deposit, is it refundable in full or partly refundable or none at all or negotiable? For me, it should depend on the time. If for some reasons client wants to delay or cancel and I almost finish the site, then no refund.
What do you think?

John

[Technosailor]

34% initial (non-refundable)
33% on design approval
33% on publication

The last 2 deposits are refundable at any time upon work stoppage.

Sketch

[beley]

We have an extensive client area on our site... we're in the process of expanding it at the moment but you're free to check it out... http://www.cywebsites.com

We have tutorials, tech support, etc. but also have a password protected area where clients can preview their site in several stages. First, logos and screenshots - then the actual site... on our server. When they final approve it we move it to their server.

[Teladora]

I always let clients look at their site in progress online, from design comps on. I think it's an essential part of the service I provide and the only way I know to get feedback and approvals that mean anything. I put the files in a "test site" folder on my own web server. If the site requires installation of perl scripts I have the client pay up front for web hosting and I go ahead and put everything on their server. I get 50% up front and it's in my contract that the site belongs to me until it's paid for in full, but none of my clients so far have the software or would know how to download a site anyway. A client who would do that needs to hear from your lawyer, but I don't think the risk is high.

[Technosailor]

Teladora,

I agree with you. Most clients don't have the means or know-how to steal your site. If they did, they probably would be doing their own site. It's bad business to assume that clients are stealing the code, not that anyone here is assuming that, but I think it's important to note that most clients are not crooks and there is that notion of legal action. It may not have ever been said, but it is understood. So I agree.

Sketch

[gluefish]

Fluffykins said:

>>If your TOS states that until payment is received in full the website belongs to your company, and only when payment is received does the site's ownership transfer over the the client you should be ok

That's the best advice I've heard in a long time, Fluffykins. Do you have a sample of that contract?

I charge a straight $50 an hour for my back end SQL work. My wife won't let me do contracts because I've ended up on the short end of so many of them. How do I protect my ownership of the code in that case, or DO I?

[beley]

When you say she won't let you do contracts, do you mean she won't let you quote an exact price? Because that's not the same thing. We work by the hour - and although we give an ESTIMATED number of hours, it can change.

We have the client sign a contract and Terms & Conditions statement that states we have ownership of the work until paid for. If we are half-way done, and they pay us for the time we have worked we will hand it over. However, if we have worked one hour that they have not paid for the work is not theirs.

[gluefish]

Well, I actually meant she won't let me quote an exact price. I am famous in my family for underbidding my jobs. My wife says if I estimate a job she insists on doubling the number and incrementing the time division: If I think it'll take me 2 days, she says it'll take 4 weeks. I gave up trying to figure that out in '92 and have been happiest just charging by the hour.

Now, estimating the job, that's another matter. I have a customer I estimated a week's work on a small dBase app in 1987.

I'm still working on it. It grew into a FoxPro app, then a VB/Access app, then a VB/SQL Server app, and finally an ASP/VB/SQL Server app.

He's still happily paying me for it too... it made him rich.