Smiley Central on AzoogleAds - URGENT: Int. Divert

[incka]

I just had to jump in on this comment.

There are no laws stating that a corporation has to maximize profit...

I think you are taking things a little too far here.

Dodge vs. Ford.

Ford cut the prices of his vehicles and gave employees a wage rise instead of paying a divident. Dodge wanted to use his dividend to set up his own car company. He sued Fordw for not maximising profit, and won.

[fireklown]

Dodge vs. Ford.

Ford cut the prices of his vehicles and gave employees a wage rise instead of paying a divident. Dodge wanted to use his dividend to set up his own car company. He sued Fordw for not maximising profit, and won.

umm... huh? what does that have to do with anything

Dodge v Ford (1919) was about how Ford was going to not give dividends in the year, rather they were keeping them to use for personal reasons. Much like Enron, and Global Crossing. Dodge brothers sued, claiming that Ford was using shareholder equity to pursue his own personal philanthropic goals

Michigan supreme court rules for Dodge that company equity may only be used for use for achiving goals for the company.

the case has nothing to do with maxamising profits. It's about raiding company equity for personal use.

The goal of a company is to make money, yes. But not by an any means neccesary path. Misappropriating targeted campaigns as badly as they do, goes above and beyond the lines of ethics.

using your theory of maxamising profits no matter what, you could go into McDonalds. But a cheeseburger. Give them a $20 bill and have them refuse to give you change back and say "Sorry, just maximising profits, we're a corporation, we have to do this... come again"

[scifie]

scifie, where did you get the emoticon background from? Looks nice

It was so long ago I totally forget

[fryman]

Can you go have your chat about Ford in another board? This is for discussing affiliate programs and we are talking about Azoogleads

[incka]

using your theory of maxamising profits no matter what, you could go into McDonalds. But a cheeseburger. Give them a $20 bill and have them refuse to give you change back and say "Sorry, just maximising profits, we're a corporation, we have to do this... come again"

This wouldn't maximise profit as the customer would never go back to them again, therefore they would loose potential profit.

[andy_boyd]

I've spoken with my Az rep and he assures me that they will be raising the CPA significantly to compensate.

Dunno about everyone else, but my Az income is depressing now. $0.11 really sucks.

[incka]

I think moving to the hotbar campaign on budsinc might make more for us now than the smiley central on azoogle will.

[Rolando]

not that I want to sound disrespectful... but I thought I read this on the AzoogleAds website: "With AzoogleAds™, there are never any surprises..."

[incka]

AzoogleAds seem to change their slogan a lot...

[fryman]

I wonder how long this will take... I don't even bother to check my daily stats any more... really lousy earnings since this started.

[BeauCreative]

I was told that askjeeves had to "discuss it among themselves" about increasing the CPA to azoogle's request. Apperantly they "should have an answer by the end of the week"

As for the targetting

"Ask Jeeves says their targetting is functioning properly"

[Fahd]

This wouldn't maximise profit as the customer would never go back to them again, therefore they would loose potential profit.

Doesn't the same apply here? Publishers like yourself would feel cheated by azoogle and never go back to them? Or azoogle wil feel cheated by AJI and never run any of their campaigns again?

[joeazoogleads]

Our meeting with AskJeeves went well and they are 100% aware of the impact their geo-targeting requirement has had. I even showed the director this sitepoint thread so they could fully understand the issue at hand.

Again, as promised there will be large changes in the CPA. Since we are not the advertiser we cannot make these changes on our own, effectively we are at their mercy, just as the webmasters running their campaign.

I will say that while the CPA will be increasing significantly (we expect an answer by this Fri or next Mon), that they have been paying US rates for international traffic for the last 2 1/2 years. Now that this will not be continuing, your targeting of the Smiley campaigns will have to be more focused. Non-US traffic, while abundant, just does not convert for AJ. They can't monetize it, and it was dragging down the entire campaign's CPA.

We have over 2,000 webmasters running these Smiley campaigns, and many will be making much more after the CPA/Geo increase, and others will be making much less. The difference will all come down to your division of US vs international traffic.

I do want to make a quick note, while I understand many of you are looking for alternative sources of revenue in the interim, please be careful with other download programs, as many if not all install adware/spyware. Remember one of the more intriguing things about the Smiley campaigns is that there is an actual value given to the end user, without all of the spyware attachments.

I know it's been a difficult week, god knows we have seen a HUGE drop off in revenue for this campaign, but in the end I hope AskJeeves does the right thing and makes up for this tough week.

Let's keep our fingers crossed!

-Joe

[fryman]

Thanks for the update, Joe, and lets hope that things improve soon.

[RevenuePilot]

Joe just to be fair smiley central also installs Ask Jeeves toolbar which is an adware, also as an example hotbar also offers smileys, etc.. so at the end of the day I don’t see much difference between Ask Jeeves product and hotbar along with others. In your comment you said and I quote: “download programs, as many if not all install adware/spyware.” so are you trying to say that Ask Jeeves toolbar is not adware?

[incka]

Personally I don't call it adware, I call it annoy-ware. It doesn't popup ads, etc, but it does annoy you without being an advert.

[RevenuePilot]

From Wikipedia: “Adware or advertising-supported software is any software application in which advertisements are displayed while the program is running. These applications include additional code that displays the ads in pop-up windows or through a bar that appears on a computer screen.”


Now the last time I personally tested smiley central download I found Ask Jeeves toolbar installed in my browser as a result of smileys download, perhaps to somebody its not ad ware but to me it is! Now I am not saying giving out toolbars is wrong but it should be made clear that toolbar is being downloaded on user pc rather then simply bundling the product with smileys and promoting smileys as a product and not mentioning anything about the toolbar! However as long as everything is done according to law it is fine from the marketing standpoint, the only thing I personally dont like is people saying its not adware in clear cases of product being adware! If its adware just say it is instead of trying to say it is just some product, etc...

[joeazoogleads]

Update:


The Smiley US/UK pricing will be increasing in stages (as the retention metrics come in). The first increase will occur tomorrow (the 29th).

The Smiley International payout will be almost tripling, this will not be happening in stages, but will be going into effect tomorrow (29th).

More information will be coming each week as the retention metrics are evaluated.

I hope this helps,

Joe

[incka]

Perhaps you've saved me from switching to hotbar. Thanks for working on our behalf to get ask jeeves to change their rates.

[AzoogleAds]

Just my 2 cents..

The Ask Jeeves bar is NOT adware, it does not monitor your activity online, it is the same thing as the Google Toolbar. In fact, the results generated by searching through the Jeeves toolbar are the same you would get when you search through Google's toolbar, as Jeeves is partnered with Google and derives most of their revenue FROM Google. Do you consider the Google toolbar adware? If not, then there is no reason to consider the Jeeves toolbar adware either. There is no additional software being installed, they don't monitor your computer use, nor do they serve ads within the toolbar or via popups.

Alex

[service@musiccds]

Does any one want to exchange links with my free smileys website? (http://www.Free-Smileys.net) I have a PR4

[Arkham]

Just my 2 cents..

The Ask Jeeves bar is NOT adware, it does not monitor your activity online, it is the same thing as the Google Toolbar. In fact, the results generated by searching through the Jeeves toolbar are the same you would get when you search through Google's toolbar, as Jeeves is partnered with Google and derives most of their revenue FROM Google. Do you consider the Google toolbar adware? If not, then there is no reason to consider the Jeeves toolbar adware either. There is no additional software being installed, they don't monitor your computer use, nor do they serve ads within the toolbar or via popups.

Smiley Central has always distributed adware/spyware/scumware. I didn't know they moved to AskJeeves, but they used to (still?) distribute Mywebsearch/+others that were some of the worst examples of that sorta thing.

Here's an ancient link -- they've been doing this for a while:

http://www.eagle-wing.net/ClickPicks.../Spam-07.shtml

I checked the TOS last week and saw that they had another My*something*search toolbar in there, still.

I've already blocked azoogle servers and I'm boycotting all sites that advertise that POS Smiley package.

I wish you'd be pickier with your advertisers. The net is a joke now thanks to networks like yours who don't care about malware.

[joeazoogleads]

Update:


Smiley Central US will be going BACK to the way it was tomorrow (5/10/05). The price will be coming back down to normal levels but the geo-targetting will be removed. Both AskJeeves and AzAds have agreed the results were not what was intended, and AskJeeves is willing to give the older structure a try again.

We urge you to do your best and limit the international traffic coming through the US URL. If the international traffic continues to increase the CPA will be reduced for everyone across the board. This is the last thing we want to see.

To sum things up, thanks to sitepoints active responses, and feedback Askjeeves has decided to listen, and respond effectively. Good job guys!!

- Joe

[andy_boyd]

That's great news!

Thanks for keeping us informed.

[drbones]

Update:


Smiley Central US will be going BACK to the way it was tomorrow (5/10/05). The price will be coming back down to normal levels but the geo-targetting will be removed. Both AskJeeves and AzAds have agreed the results were not what was intended, and AskJeeves is willing to give the older structure a try again.

We urge you to do your best and limit the international traffic coming through the US URL. If the international traffic continues to increase the CPA will be reduced for everyone across the board. This is the last thing we want to see.

To sum things up, thanks to sitepoints active responses, and feedback Askjeeves has decided to listen, and respond effectively. Good job guys!!

- Joe

Its 5/11/05 and im still seeing international leads... Is this getting remedied soon?