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  1. #1
    SitePoint Wizard westmich's Avatar
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    Does anyone care that McViegh is about to die?

    I know that sounds callous and that the principals of the death penalty have been discussed to death (no pun intended), but I am just curious.

    As a Christian and someone morally opposed to the death penalty, I feel a little guilty by the fact that I have no sympathy or desire to pray for him or any feelings at all for the man. I just wish that this would be over and done with.

    Am I a cold-bolded, hypocrite? Or does the extremeness of some situations justify one to bend his or her own principals?
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  2. #2
    SitePoint Evangelist mad-onion's Avatar
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    Yes i care that he is about to die! While i have no real sympathy for him, nor do i think he wants or cares for the sympathy of civilians i strongly believe the US government as a whole is about to make a very grave mistake! One that is not irreversible and will have far reaching implications...i wont say anymore and that because i would be going seriously off topic!

    BTW: I lie to the right politically wise, not extremely right but this i am not some pussy nosed left winger
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  3. #3
    Destiny Manager Plebius's Avatar
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    I don't necessarily have sympathy for him, however I don't think he deserves to die. Revenge never really accomplishes anything usefull, I've found.

  4. #4
    SitePoint Member Craig Armstrong's Avatar
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    When a man kills another man, his penalty is that he himself is killed... by another man, whom it is *okay* to do so and get's no penalty. Where's the logic in this?
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  5. #5
    SitePoint Wizard creole's Avatar
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    I have no sympathy for him or for his actions. While I am a supporter of the death penalty, his death really means nothing to me.

    Just as an aside, when the US government puts McVeigh to death, it won't be revenge, it will be justice as served by a court of law.

    Also, whether you agree with the policy or not, the US judicial system has the death penalty available to it as punishment for crimes commited. McVeigh knew that and still chose to commit this heinous crime. Should he then be found innocent and left alone?
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  6. #6
    ********* Callithumpian silver trophy freakysid's Avatar
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    Westmich, I'm disapointed you didn't make this a poll

    We're having an office party to celebrate.
    I'm ecstatic!
    Quite happy.
    Quietly content with the knowledge.
    Indifferent.
    Displeased.
    Strongly displeased.
    Distraught.
    Angry and quite irate.
    So angry I could kill someone.

  7. #7
    SitePoint Evangelist mad-onion's Avatar
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    Does McVeigh care that is the question? It is obvious his recent attempts at getting a stay were nothing more than a last ditch attempt to embarass the feds! He is ready to die according to his lawyers.
    Creole i feel you are on the button with
    "McVeigh knew that and still chose to commit this heinous crime."

    I dont think McVeigh really minds if he is executed or not, infact according to him he would rather die than be pushed around my feds (prison guards) for the rest of his life! Maybe if his death gives some peace to the victims then thats good but i still think the fbi have been made to look like fools once again!
    They are supposed to be the worlds premiere police force and yet they dont seem to be able to use simple filing systems effectively

    I would almost go as far as to say Tim has got a pretty chump deal... he commits the crime he wants to and then he gets the punishment he wants!!!!

    I bet this post will get alot of damning response
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  8. #8
    Anyone seen my cypher? OneChance's Avatar
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    Yaaaaaawn. McVeigh who? Oh, him. Ummmm, whether he lives or dies doesn't affect me in the slightest. He's going to die tomorrow whether we like it or not, so no reason giving it a second thought. Now would someone wake me up when he's dead so I can celebrate with a beer? Back to bed I go.

  9. #9
    SitePoint Enthusiast chickaboom's Avatar
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    I thought the results from a recent Gallup poll (shown on tv) were remarkable:

    80% favored the death penalty for McVeigh
    23% of those who opposed the death penalty were okay with McVeigh being put to death

    I can think of no other issue in recent years that Americans came to such a clear consensus - relatively speaking. It's practically unanimous.

    From the beginning, the media should never have given him so much airtime.
    The circle of life

  10. #10
    SitePoint Addict z7's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Craig Armstrong
    When a man kills another man, his penalty is that he himself is killed... by another man, whom it is *okay* to do so and get's no penalty. Where's the logic in this?
    Quite.

  11. #11
    SitePoint Addict z7's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Plebius
    I don't necessarily have sympathy for him, however I don't think he deserves to die. Revenge never really accomplishes anything usefull, I've found.
    Y'know it.

    The victims still have to deal with their pain.

  12. #12
    Fried Gold Polymath's Avatar
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    >>>When a man kills another man, his penalty is that he himself is killed... by another man..

    No, he is killed by the law, the man is just an instrument of the law, just as the bomb is an instrument of a terrorist. So if you say that McVeigh killed those people, you must say that the law killed McVeigh.

    >>>Revenge never really accomplishes anything usefull, I've found.

    Well, I wouldn't call it revenge, I would call it the law, and in this case the useful thing accomplished is removing someone who thinks it's fine to kill 168 people in the name of (insert ideology here).


    He's gone now anyway.

  13. #13
    SitePoint Addict z7's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Polymath
    Well, I wouldn't call it revenge, I would call it the law, and in this case the useful thing accomplished is removing someone who thinks it's fine to kill 168 people in the name of (insert ideology here).
    It was some sort of twisted revenge against the New World Order for the Waco thing.

    Unnecessary waste of human life I agree - but then so was Waco, and for that matter - so was Ruby Ridge but who is being held accountable for them?

    In his view it was a cry for freedom, that is if he even planted the bomb...

  14. #14
    Yugo full of anvils bronze trophy hillsy's Avatar
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    Just b/c it's the law doesn't make it right

    Given that he wanted to die, rather than being locked up for the rest of his life, wouldn't it be more appropriate to lock him up?

    So I guess I care quite a lot that he's just been killed. Even though it doesn't affect me in the slightest.

    My $0.02. Moot point now, anyway
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  15. #15
    SitePoint Wizard creole's Avatar
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    from CNN.com

    Speaking from the White House briefing room about an hour and a half after the execution, President Bush told reporters that McVeigh "met the fate he chose for himself six years ago." Bush said, "Under the laws of our country the matter is concluded."
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  16. #16
    Fried Gold Polymath's Avatar
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    Is that a yawny ?!?!
    Cool!

  17. #17
    SitePoint Wizard silver trophy TheOriginalH's Avatar
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    Originally posted by creole

    Just as an aside, when the US government puts McVeigh to death, it won't be revenge, it will be justice as served by a court of law.

    You say tomatoe......
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  18. #18
    Serial Publisher silver trophy aspen's Avatar
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    When I read the news blurb that he was dead I applauded.
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  19. #19
    SitePoint Addict Seer's Avatar
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    I've got mixed opinions on this and haven't really decided how I feel about it. One, I can see it being "law" but I don't see how all these people gathering around and having watched that execution is going to solve anything. I think that picture is somewhat disturbing. This man goes out and murders all these people and in turn is executed in front of an audience. He's quoted as saying the victims were "Collateral damage", I think he should have eaten a bullet at that very moment. But that's anger and I think far too much anger has been fed into this situation by the media, etc. Perhaps it's justified, perhaps not.. Either way, it's over. Right?
    Everything has been figured out, except how to live. - Jean-Paul Sartre (1905-1980)

  20. #20
    SitePoint Wizard creole's Avatar
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    Unfortunately it's far from over (IMO).

    First there will be the obligatory 1-2 weeks coverage on his death and the results of the first Federal exectution in 30 some years.

    Second, will come the replies to that coverage

    Thirdly in about 6 months, we will start to see books about him. "McVeigh, the man you never saw" and ***** like that.
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  21. #21
    SitePoint Addict Seer's Avatar
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    Very true.. I think this man was given exactly what he wanted, he'll be played out as a martyr for years. People wanted him dead so they could forget about him. Fact is, they've just immortalised him. I would much rather have seen him rot in a prison cell for the rest of his life. I think this decision was prematurely based on what people thought would make it all go away.
    Everything has been figured out, except how to live. - Jean-Paul Sartre (1905-1980)

  22. #22
    SitePoint Addict Kakarot720's Avatar
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    Good riddance to bad rubbish!!!

  23. #23
    Nice Mug jer's Avatar
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    First off, he was quoted as saying he was "at peace with himself", so in that case he's indifferent whether he lives or dies. But just because he's accepting of it doesn't make it right.

    Why is this law so different than all the others? You don't punish an arsonist by burning down his house. You don't punish a rapist by having him raped. So why is this so different? I see it as illogical, and it really doesn't solve anything. If anything, it serves to further dehumanize the families of the victims.

    Yes I believe he was wrong, severely wrong. It was a horrible, horrible henious crime. However, killing him does not solve anything. I think these people will end up having even more psychological problems for having watched.

    For those of you who support the death penalty, if you believe in it that much then you would have no problem with putting him to death yourself right? If nobody else would?

    What about watching? How can anyone, anyone willingly watch the murder of another human being, and what's worse, they expect to feel BETTER for having seen it! Am I the only one seriously disturbed by this?
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  24. #24
    Next stop: PHP! Marina's Avatar
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    No, jer, you are not the only one. I have even heard the parents of some kids, that were killed in the bombing, say that killing McVeigh will not make them feel any better.
    The only good thing about him being put to death is that it makes us discuss death penalty and maybe come up with better ideas of preventing violence.

  25. #25
    SitePoint Addict Kakarot720's Avatar
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    I think McVeigh deserved to die b/c he harmed/took innocent lives for no reason at all. A life sentence would not have been severe enough punishment IMO. Like Creole said, McVeigh knew exacly what he was doing when he did it.

    How am I supposed to care or feel sympathy for a man who killed innocent people just because he felt like it?

    As stated b4..Good riddance to bad rubbish..


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