SitePoint Sponsor

User Tag List

View Poll Results: To Apple Or Not To Apple?

Voters
27. You may not vote on this poll
  • Apple!

    17 62.96%
  • Not to Apple!

    10 37.04%
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 27

Thread: Why Apple?

  1. #1
    SitePoint Enthusiast stoopid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Vilnius, Lithuania
    Posts
    64
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Unhappy Why Apple?

    Hello all,
    I am from part of Europe where Apple is not so popular as in USA, i think, well, its not popular at all...

    But i want to ask you, why do most of web designers choose and work with apple computers? Of course they look VERY nice, but what about technical part of this? Are they more reliable than ordinary pc with windows or standard laptop?

    And if you have to choose, would it be Apple PowerBook or Ordinary Laptop?

  2. #2
    Your Lord and Master, Foamy gold trophy Hierophant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 1999
    Location
    Lancaster, Ca. USA
    Posts
    12,305
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I don't think Web Developers work with Macintoshes more often than they work with Windows PCs. That is a false perception. Macintoshes are certainly more visible in music editing and high-end standalone graphics workstations but not as general purpose development machines.

    Personally, I think you are severely limiting your applications options on the Macintosh. Sure there is a replacement or two for most major program segments but the variety is still not there.

    For a laptop, I would go with a PC and get more overall bang for my buck, better support options, more expandability, and more choice. If Apple isn't popular in your country and not readily available then you will have problems with support and service should it be needed. If I were to purchase a Macintosh, it would be one of the new headless Macs and then it would most likely be more of a novelty than a serious workstation. I have been examining them since they were released and will probably buy one but I don't foresee the Macintosh replacing my Windows and Linux machines in the foreseeable future.
    Wayne Luke
    ------------


  3. #3
    ☆★☆★ silver trophy vgarcia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    in transition
    Posts
    21,235
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    I wouldn't buy an "ordinary" laptop no matter what OS is on it. If you're sticking with x86, at least get something with a good processor and battery life, like an IBM Thinkpad with a Centrino processor.

  4. #4
    Can we go to a 48 hour day?
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    906
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Here Here! I've owned Gateway, multiple toshiba, and dell laptops and I'm never going back after owning this thinkpad.

    Personally I use linux web servers and on my laptop so the advantage apple would have for me is a pretty gui with a terminal ready for me. It's more the OS that is the advantage for me. One day I'll get one, but I need a laptop that goes where I go and performs well and they're not things you buy every year.
    mitechie.com
    "Techies just think a little differently
    ...at least that is what they keep telling me."

  5. #5
    Put your best practices away. The New Guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    2,087
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Its just a bandwagon thing. Alot of big designers and developers here, and other places promote Macs so much that people believe that it will actually help them be better developers/designers, which just isnt true. This is the same type of thing that happened about a year ago with Linux. Developers here and other places were using Linux to develope and design, which was unheard of. Then once some lists of software came out it became a viable option and some people made the "switch". Same thing with macs, once people in the know showed people what software could be used, the mac also became a viable option. However both Linux and Mac offer nothing new, and atleast Linux is free.

    So what do you get when you buy a mac? An over priced computer with a new OS which you have to learn, just to be exactly as productive as before. Awsome!

    That being said there is alot of great things Mac has to offer its just for web dev it is simply meeting the bar.

    My final stab at Mac will be that alot people say its more stable and nobody has problems with it. Thats complete junk, go through the apple tech support forums, and you see questions like: "Is my video card dead?", "Fan doesnt work" etc. And before you say thats not as nearly as much as PC problems remember mac only has like a 2% market share.

    *Prepares for beatings*
    "A nerd who gets contacts
    and a trendy hair cut is still a nerd"

    - Stephen Colbert on Apple Users

  6. #6
    SitePoint Wizard ChrisRoss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    2,535
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Hardly a bandwagon thing... Its called most designers were brought up on a Mac took classes on a Mac, so they use Macs. The same will go for the designers that were brought up on a PC, they use what they know.

    Add the fact that designers normally have taste (developers are a different story), they always have to have the cool looking PC and a VW to match. Apple sells a slick product that has the wow factor. I would love to take a survy and how many Mac users drive VW's, I bet its up there.

    Bottom-line is your productivity is going to suffer if you switch platforms because you have to get used to the new OS.

    The reason a lot of people switch is because the are sick of spyware, sick of viruses, sick of not being able to fix their own problems, etc. You rarely here of Mac users switching to the PC platform, unless they are forced to by work. There is a reason for this, Mac users like their Macs but trying to explain it in a forum will just start the age old debate. You really shouldn't even comment unless you have worked on both OSX and XP for a decent amount of time. Once you have done that then you can look at both OS's and decide yourself. But most likely it will come back to what you know best... what you were brought up on. Why do you think Apple fights for the education market... The same reason Pepsi and Coke fight to be put there pop machines into schools. So they get hooked early!
    Golf Outings? OutingCaddy.com
    Organize - Invite - Create Free website for your golf outing!

  7. #7
    SitePoint Wizard samsm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Atlanta, GA, USA
    Posts
    5,011
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    There are two fair reasons I can think of to eliminate Mac as an option. One would be games, you want up to the second games. The other would be industry-specific... specific software made for your profession, only available on Windows. If that's you, you know it, and oh well.

    However, I think the "availability of applications" argument against Mac is overstated.

    First of all, most common applications are covered on Mac, and they are covered well. By covered well, I mean you don't have to hunt for a special application because the one that came installed on your Mac is just that good.

    Second, there may be a gazillion Windows applications out there, but Windows users are terrified to actually use them for fear of it digging its teeth into the registry and bringing the down the whole ship!

    Maybe I've just been blessed with ignorance or have never needed some application that is only available on Windows. What are some specific examples of useful applications that are not available on Mac? Maybe I'll find a new way to appriciate this XP I'm using right now.
    Using your unpaid time to add free content to SitePoint Pty Ltd's portfolio?

  8. #8
    Your Lord and Master, Foamy gold trophy Hierophant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 1999
    Location
    Lancaster, Ca. USA
    Posts
    12,305
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by iwinweekly.com
    Add the fact that designers normally have taste (developers are a different story), they always have to have the cool looking PC and a VW to match. Apple sells a slick product that has the wow factor. I would love to take a survy and how many Mac users drive VW's, I bet its up there.
    Maybe this is because after buying the Apple products, you can't afford the Lexus, Infinity, BMW, or Mercedes... This means you have to settle for a cutesy chick mobile which is also overpriced for what you get.
    Wayne Luke
    ------------


  9. #9
    Can we go to a 48 hour day?
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    906
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    lol, feel the love
    mitechie.com
    "Techies just think a little differently
    ...at least that is what they keep telling me."

  10. #10
    Your Lord and Master, Foamy gold trophy Hierophant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 1999
    Location
    Lancaster, Ca. USA
    Posts
    12,305
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by samsm
    Maybe I've just been blessed with ignorance or have never needed some application that is only available on Windows. What are some specific examples of useful applications that are not available on Mac? Maybe I'll find a new way to appriciate this XP I'm using right now.
    Well the program I use to create labels for my products for one... It is by Broderbund. Not a very expensive program only coming in at $40.00 but it has options that larger programs don't have like the ability to print only X labels off a sheet starting at Y position. Plus it is quick and easy in the layout. Considering I have over 1400 labels already created, it would be a nightmare to move to a new platform, find a new application with the features I need, and recreate them all. Already spent many hours over two years creating them.

    I am sure each person's needs are going to be different but that $40.00 program is a dealkiller because nothing like it exists on the Macintosh that I can find. Because of this program, a Macintosh would be a novelty for me. I do have some ideas for using one in a retail store but only if I can get a touch screen for it.

    And yes, I will admit the headless Macintosh Mini is an afforable solution if you just want to experience the Macintosh as a secondary device with your existing monitor, keyboard, and mouse but it is no less expensive than other Macintosh offerings if this is your first computer purchase. A workable bottom line Macintosh Mini will still cost over $1000 with proper memory, monitor, keyboard, and mouse upgrades. Might as well get an iMac for that.
    Wayne Luke
    ------------


  11. #11
    SitePoint Wizard ChrisRoss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    2,535
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Hierophant
    Maybe this is because after buying the Apple products, you can't afford the Lexus, Infinity, BMW, or Mercedes... This means you have to settle for a cutesy chick mobile which is also overpriced for what you get.
    Hey I don't drive a VW... Doesn't bother me. Funny you mentioned all the car brands that have formed partnerships with Apple in the last months.
    Golf Outings? OutingCaddy.com
    Organize - Invite - Create Free website for your golf outing!

  12. #12
    ☆★☆★ silver trophy vgarcia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    in transition
    Posts
    21,235
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Play nice everyone...

  13. #13
    Mazel tov! bronze trophy kohoutek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Hamburg, Germany
    Posts
    4,248
    Mentioned
    30 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by The New Guy
    Its just a bandwagon thing. Alot of big designers and developers here, and other places promote Macs so much that people believe that it will actually help them be better developers/designers, which just isnt true.
    It has very little to do with bandwagon behaviour. Same could be said for PC as well, if you so choose to go down that path in argumentation. They're both corporate products, both companies are GIANTS within the market.

    Many times Mac seems more attractive particularly to designers. Aesthetics perhaps? Apple knows this and they have their audience, just as PC has a truly large gamers audience. The audience is different, the priorities and principles upon which these systems are built are different.

    In fact, I'll go as far as saying that creativiy CAN indeed suffer from a poorly designed computer in some cases. It's your working space, your office. An ugly office will not matter to many. It will, however, matter to some. It depends on how your perception works. Some people just want things to work . Others want things to work AND be attractive or else we could be using the DOS interface for our daily tasks with nothing but white text on a blue background. To me, the environment - that is my office, my hobby or whatever - needs to be in harmony with my aesthetic perception. If I despise the tools I'm working with, the walls I'm staring at, the furniture I spend hours on, yeah, then I'll most likely not find it to be as much joy to work. I love beautiful objects. And while their non-existence is not a hindrance to my creativity per se, it is a great hindrance to my psyche and that in turn can indeed be a problem many times.

    This is a very typical behaviour of many artists. Not all as there are just as many who don't care about that stuff. It's a matter of preference and an artist's individual perception.
    Maleika E. A. | Rockatee | Twitter | Dribbble



  14. #14
    SitePoint Wizard trampt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Newport, RI
    Posts
    1,997
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    You can buy a PC or a Mac, they are both computers. You can also but a Ford Focus or a Mercedes S500, they are both cars.

    I am not saying that a Mac is superior in all ways because its not. However if you want a system that has an superior OS, no spyware, no/minimal virus worries, solid applications, better hardware engineering, high resale value, etc. Then I would go with a Mac.

    If you want to save your money on cheaper machine, that does everything a mac does but is PLAGUED with virus, spyware, bad OS functionality, constant security holes, noisy clunky cases and components, and no resale value. Then I would go PC. Also playing the latest and greatest games you would want a PC. If you don't mind waiting an extra month or so, or don't play games than this is a non-issue.

    I've used a PC's for 10 years, and mainly built them because they were so affordable. However, since being on a fully loaded G5 for the last year I must say that I would NEVER go back to a PC, unless I couldn't afford it. Funny how its always the PC users that wonder if they should get a Mac, and not the Mac people wondering if they should get a PC.

  15. #15
    Put your best practices away. The New Guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    2,087
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Security through obscurity isnt security at all. I cant even remember the last time I had a virus (3-4 years) and the only time I got spyware was before that term was even coined.
    "A nerd who gets contacts
    and a trendy hair cut is still a nerd"

    - Stephen Colbert on Apple Users

  16. #16
    SitePoint Wizard trampt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Newport, RI
    Posts
    1,997
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I'm not going to get tied up in all this arguing since everyone has their own personal preference and attitudes for or against Mac's.

    All virus, spyware, games, etc aside. Mac's are better engineered machines, that last longer, resell for more, and the OS is far superior to PC's running a form a windows.

    I think that is a pretty good reason to own one.

  17. #17
    SitePoint Wizard realestate's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    1,092
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I like safari browser. Other than this I don't know.
    Windows os is a lot of pain. You have to download antivirus and it will not work and there is no support at all.

  18. #18
    Non-Member Egor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    7,305
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by trampt
    Funny how its always the PC users that wonder if they should get a Mac, and not the Mac people wondering if they should get a PC.
    Yeah, once you go Mac, you never go back. Surely there's something other than external looks that makes us stick to Apples Computers.

    I had been using PC's for over 7 years when I decided to give Macs a shot. I was looking for a laptop when I decided to try the iBook G4. It's been running exceptionally well for the 6 months I've had it.

  19. #19
    SitePoint Zealot CatsEyeDesigns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    160
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    To me, the differences are virtually irrelevant b/c they both have enough advantages that they cancel each other out.

    Let's see....
    Mac's are prettier, last a little longer, and are *SLIGHTLY* more reliable. But on the other hand, they are noticeably more expensive.
    PC's require a little more planning in the preventative maintenance department (Antivirus, Anitspyware, Firewall's, OS updates, etc.). They're not as pretty. But to their credit, PC's are easier to work on or build at home, and are significantly less expensive.

    I've worked on both platforms enough to be comfortable on each, but I'm more experienced with a PC so that's what I use. I could go buy a mac, and I'm comfortable enough with the OS that it wouldn't cause me any major productivity losses. But the differences aren't important enough for me to bother with switching.

    And for any of you who haven't seen the "mac switch" parody video, I almost fell out of my chair watching this thing.... enjoy.

  20. #20
    SitePoint Wizard trampt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Newport, RI
    Posts
    1,997
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by CatsEyeDesigns
    And for any of you who haven't seen the "mac switch" parody video, I almost fell out of my chair watching this thing.... enjoy.
    Doesn't play on my Mac.

  21. #21
    Can we go to a 48 hour day?
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    906
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by trampt
    Doesn't play on my Mac.
    http://www.danslagle.com/mac/iMovie/...s/3000.shtml#2

    Guess Macs do too much handholding in the end. Gotta get Pc guys to help you play .avi files.
    mitechie.com
    "Techies just think a little differently
    ...at least that is what they keep telling me."

  22. #22
    SitePoint Wizard ChrisRoss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    2,535
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by trampt
    Doesn't play on my Mac.
    Plays on mine.

    All you need to do is make sure your quicktime is up to date (i'm running 6.5.2)

    This parody is funny but the issues this guys brings up are all pre OSX issues. I remember when this came out thinking, "great another PC users that used OS 8.6 once made a movie"
    Golf Outings? OutingCaddy.com
    Organize - Invite - Create Free website for your golf outing!

  23. #23
    SitePoint Zealot CatsEyeDesigns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    160
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    actually, if you look up the guy that did the video, you'll see that ALL of the gripes there are current gripes and he is actually an avid Mac user, but recognizes that platform just isn't as perfect as some like to think it is.

    Here's the reference for you if you want it. http://www.happynowhere.net/mac_parody.php

  24. #24
    SitePoint Wizard ChrisRoss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    2,535
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Oh this is a different one.. my bad. I didn't even watch it, there are so many.
    Golf Outings? OutingCaddy.com
    Organize - Invite - Create Free website for your golf outing!

  25. #25
    SitePoint Wizard silver trophy Karl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Derbyshire, UK
    Posts
    4,411
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I agree on the security by obscurity is not security at all, I seem to remember several OSX security issues not so long ago, and as more people use Macs, more will be found - The reason Windows is attacked so much, is because most computers run Windows, if you want to find a machine that isn't patched, then you search the machines that have the majority of market share, you don't go for something with a small percentage of the market, it's not an efficient use of time/resources.

    Noisey clunky cases - Stop buying cheap $20 cases then.

    Reliability - Would I be wrong in thinking there is a class action forming against Apple by iBook users?

    As for the no going back once you've used a Mac, not true, I worked with a designer who had used Macs since they came on the scene, built him his first PC, and he's rarely used his Macs since.

    Don't get me wrong, I quite like Macs and am considering a mini, at the end of the day, I don't care if it runs Windows, MacOS, Linux, DOS, whatever as long as I can get my work done.
    Karl Austin :: Profile :: KDA Web Services Ltd.
    Business Web Hosting :: Managed Dedicated Hosting
    Call 0800 542 9764 today and ask how we can help your business grow.


Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •