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  1. #1501
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    Sorry if this has been asked earlier in the thread, but what do I do if I don't know the height of the footer? I know the initial height, but the footer-area may sometimes contain a sub menu, and I have to take into consideration that this sub menu can contain an unknown number of items that can span over 1-2 rows..

    Do I have to check for the footer height with javascript after the page has loaded, and then set the negative margin accordingly, or can it be done with pure css?

  2. #1502
    In memoriam gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy Dan Schulz's Avatar
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    As far as I know, you'll have to know the height of the footer. If it's going to change with dynamic content, then you'll have to use JavaScript to detect the changes and apply the updated heights dynamically as well.

  3. #1503
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    Hi,

    As Dan said you have to have a fixed height for the footer to work otherwise you can't account for the space exactly.

    If the footer is going to be changing height frequently then perhaps you would be better off with just a normal footer. The sticky footer is only useful on small pages where you want the footer at the bottom but most sites are usually higher than the viewport anyway so it doesn't really matter.

  4. #1504
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    Paul you are very fearfulness
    study it

  5. #1505
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    Thank you Dan Schulz and Paul O'B. I probably have to go for the jacascript solution, as I doubt the designer is willing to change the whole footer area..

    Or I can just make another class ie: footer-with-submenu, that adds about 50px or so to the initial footer, and do the same for the content-wrapper, and use these if there's a sub-menu..

  6. #1506
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    Or I can just make another class ie: footer-with-submenu, that adds about 50px or so to the initial footer, and do the same for the content-wrapper, and use these if there's a sub-menu..
    As long as you change the three important things together (footer height, negative margin and clearer height) then you should be able to set up a class that you can add to the body element to effect the changes dynamically.

  7. #1507
    SitePoint Zealot MacRankin's Avatar
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    Hi there, it's me again. God (or P' OB), I know, I know. I never know when to stop, but I reckon I've done a better job with these 2 latest layouts of mine, or rather one that is based on Dan Cederholm's 'Sliding Faux Columns', and the other one which is based on CSS Tables...

    Sliding Faux Layout with 3 equalizing columns
    http://www.macrankin.co.uk/layouts/dc_01b.html

    Ok, I know that this isn't pixel-perfect, and I know of one issue when re-sizing the view-port down to say, 640px, then below that both text examples on either side drop, but only (I believe?) in IE6.

    Thankfully, IE7 does support min-width / max-width, so I was able to control this layout a little bit more.


    CSS Tables with conditional comment workarounds
    http://www.macrankin.co.uk/layouts/csstables_01ie.html

    Here, I've hopefully created something that is CSS Table. Of course, I could not get this mutha to work in any IE, so I have resorted to using conditional comments.

    In the end, I had to opted for a fixed-width. In all other (normal) browsers this layout is flexible.

    Paul, I hope you won't think that I've overstepped the mark here in yet again producing something that isn't doable in the real world, but I really do feel that this time these layouts could be okay to be used.

    Erm, I'm now going to hide behind my shelter...
    We Brits do things differently. But we still get shot at.

  8. #1508
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    Erm, I'm now going to hide behind my shelter...
    No need to hide they look reasonably ok but they could be improved

    The first example you are using a clearfooter with a height of 330px which is giving you a great big gap at the bottom of your content. I'm not sure why you have done that because you don't have a sticky effect going on there.

    You can loses the 330px negative margin on your outer and lose the clearfooter height. The footer is just following the content and is not a sticky footer technique anyway. You can't use the 100% height to achieve the footer technique because you have an inner wrapper which will collapse the height to auto. (unless you apply your outerimage to the body and the inner image to the outer and the lose the innerwrapper altogether ).

    Therefore at present I would advise that you just leave the footer under the content otherwise you have a great big gap at the bottom.

    The table cell example looks better but why have you included all the css in the ie only file. It only needs about half a dozen styles so only include the changes not all the css.

    Otherwise they seem to be working ok and seem usable

  9. #1509
    SitePoint Zealot MacRankin's Avatar
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    Oh, thank you, thank you there Paul.

    For a while there, I had thought I put my footer in it.

    I have no excuse for the 300px. Sometimes my mind races (er, without thinking), and I may have had other ideas of incorporating something along the lines of ewwatson's sticky footer method, but I must have forgotten about it, and thought that it looks like it gives my content (at the bottom of the page) some breathing space.

    About that 2nd helping of css code in the conditional comment, erm yes, that is a lot of unnecessary code, and I should have cleaned it up a bit. It's just that I don't always understand what is going on in my own code, and it's just easier for me to just move code around just to see what it does. I guess you could put that down to laziness.

    Anyway, I would never leave internal styles in the finished web page for say, a website built for a friend, unless I was using some extra workaround, maybe?

    Thanks for taking the time Paul, and thanks for putting up with me and all my layouts.


    I've now made those changes you advised, so things should start to make more sense to everyone now.
    Last edited by MacRankin; Nov 7, 2008 at 12:01. Reason: To make suggested changes
    We Brits do things differently. But we still get shot at.

  10. #1510
    SitePoint Zealot MacRankin's Avatar
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    I've just added 2 jQuery files to the 'Sliding Faux Layout' to stop IE6 from reducing in size and having the text from falling apart. It shouldn't affect any of the other browsers, though.

    The jQuery MiniMax script should now be supporting the max-width, though for some reason it seems to be held at the max-width size regardless of its min-width size. So, I don't know what's going on there. Guess I'll have to live with it.
    We Brits do things differently. But we still get shot at.

  11. #1511
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    Hi i am own site use your given code but problome not fix.

  12. #1512
    The CSS Clinic is open silver trophybronze trophy
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    Quote Originally Posted by vk_2006 View Post
    Hi i am own site use your given code but problome not fix.
    Hi VK_2006,

    If you want help with a specific problem then you will need to post more details. Otherwise your post looks just like a "fluff" post.

    Please don't post the same question twice in other forums. Just provide accurate details and information and you will get the help you are searching for.

  13. #1513
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    Hi Guys,

    been reading up on the first post and all the examples contained within and have had a good play around with the code this morning but I'm still struggling. I'm sure the answer is buried in this 60+ page somewhere but I really don't have the time or inclination to read them all.

    I've got a site here that has a 2 column layout within a wrap div.

    The column on the right will 9 times out of 10 carry more content than the left column but I need the heights of both columns to adjust together regardless of content. So I've got position: relative; height:100% set on the left column and on the right. Yet, if I put more content in the right, the left does not compensate for this change and remains the height of it's content.


    Code:
    body{font-size:62.5%;}
    html, body, div, span,
    applet, object, iframe,
    h1, h2, h3, h4, h5, h6, p, blockquote, pre,
    a, abbr, acronym, address, big, cite, code,
    del, dfn, em, font, img, ins, kbd, q, s, samp,
    small, strike, strong, sub, sup, tt, var,
    fieldset, form, label, legend,li,dt,dd,
    table, caption, tbody, tfoot, thead, tr, th, td {
    	margin: 0;
    	padding: 0;
    	border: 0;
    	font-weight: inherit;
    	font-style: inherit;
    	line-height: 1;
    	font-family: inherit;
    	text-align: left;
    	vertical-align: baseline;
    	color:#000;
    	font-family: Verdana,Arial ,Helvetica,"Trebuchet MS", sans-serif; 
    }
    body{font-size:50.5%} /*62.5%*/
    a img, :link img, :visited img {
    	border: 0;
    }
    table {
    	border-collapse: collapse;
    	border-spacing: 0;
    }
    ol{
    	list-style: decimal;
    }
    ul{
    	list-style: disc;
    }
    li,dd,p{margin:0 0 10px 0; padding:0;line-height:1.4;}
    q:before, q:after,
    blockquote:before, blockquote:after {
    	content: "";
    }
    a{text-decoration:none;}
    br.clear{clear:both;font-size:0;height:0;}
    span.name{font-weight:bold;}
    h1,h1 span,h2,h3,h4,h5,h6{font-weight:bold;font-family: "Tahoma", Arial, Verdana, sans-serif;font-size:1.8em;margin-bottom:10px;}
    dt,h3{font-size:1.4em;}
    strong {font-weight:bolder}
    label {margin:0 10px 0 0;}
    /****** End Reset ******/
    
    html{height:100%}
    body{height:100%; background:#1b1560;background-image:url(../images/bckgrd.jpg); background-repeat:repeat-x;}
    #wrapper{width:870px;margin:0 auto 0 auto;}
    
    /****** Header ******/
    #header .nav{position:relative;display:block;float:right;color:white;font-size:1.2em;margin:0 20px 0 0px;}
    #header .nav a{color:silver;}
    #header .nav a:hover{color:white}
    
    
    
    /****** Navigation New *****/
    #site-nav ul{padding-left:2px;margin:0 0 0 0px;}
    #site-nav ul li{list-style:none!important;}
    #site-nav li {text-align:center;width:124px;height:49px;float:left;position:relative;margin:0 0px; }
    #site-nav li a{text-align:center;width:100%;text-decoration:none;height:100%;display:block;padding:0 5px 0 5px;color:#000;font: 1.3em/2.5 "Tahoma","Arial Black",sans-serif ; margin-top:20px;}
    #site-nav li a:hover{background-position: -120px top;color:#666;}
    
    /***** Dropdown New *****/
    #site-nav li ul{position:absolute;left:-999em;margin:0;top:0;}
    #site-nav li ul li{padding:0 5px;width:123px;height:25px;background:none;margin:0px;float:none;}
    #site-nav li ul li a{font-weight:normal;text-decoration:none;line-height:25px;width:123px;text-align:center;color:black;}
    #site-nav li ul li a:hover{color:white;}
    #site-nav li:hover ul,#site-nav li.sfhover ul{left:-8px;background:none;padding:30px 0 0 0;}
    #site-nav li:hover ul ul,#site-nav li.sfhover ul ul{left:116px;background:none;padding:0;width:123px}
    #site-nav ul li ul li.leaf.sfhover {list-style-type:none!important;}
    
    
    
    
    /****** Content ******/
    #content-wrap {background:white;padding:0;}
    #content {background:white;padding:0px;}
    
    
    /****** Content-main ******/
    
    #content-main {width:525px;float:right;margin: 0 20px 0 10px;font-size:1.2em;}
    
    #content-main h1{font-family:times,georgia,serif;font-size:2.5em;background-image:none;height:auto;width:auto;color:black;text-align:center;margin-bottom:20px;}
    #content-main h2{font-size:1.8em;margin-bottom:20px;}
    #content-main h3{font-size:1.5em;margin-bottom:10px;margin-top:20px;}
    
    #content-main #testimonials {}
    #content-main #testimonials p{}
    #content-main #testimonials strong{float:right;}
    #content-main #testimonials a{float:right;}
    #content-main #testimonials a:hover{}
    #content-main #testimonials .Twrap{margin-bottom:20px;border:1px solid #666;background-color:#efefef;padding:10px;}
    
    #content-main a{color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}
    
    #content-main h1 img{text-align:center;}
    
    
    
    
    /****** Content-Nav *****/
    #content-nav ul{list-style-type:none;width:255px;padding:0;margin:10px 0 0 10px;}
    #content-nav li{margin: 5px 0 0 0;}
    #content-nav li a:hover{background-position: 0 23px;color:#808080;background: silver;}
    
    
    
    #content-nav-testimonial li span.tone{color:#0099FF;font-weight:normal;line-height:12px;margin:0;padding:0;}
    #content-nav-testimonial li span.ttwo{color:#FF0084;font-weight:normal;line-height:12px;margin:0;padding:0;}
    #content-nav-testimonial li {color:black;font-weight:bold;}
    
    #content-nav-marketing a{display:block;height:70px;width:256px;}
    #content-nav-marketing ul{margin:0px 0 0 0px;}
    #content-nav-marketing li{height:0px;}
    
    #content-main h1{}
    #content-main h2{color:#3366cc;width:100%;border-bottom:1px solid #0099ff;line-height:30px;}
    #content-main h3{color:#000; font-family:"Times New Roman", Times, serif; font-size:32px; font-weight:100; padding:7px 0 7px 0; line-height:0px;}
    
    
    /****** Footer ******/
    
    #footer{background-color:#000000;height:28px; margin-top:0px;color:#fff; font-size:12px; padding-top:24px; clear:both; position:relative;}
    
    
    
    #footer ul {margin:0;padding:0; text-align:right; list-style:none;}
    #footer ul  *{color:#fff;}
    #footer li{margin:-3px 20px 0;float:right;font-size:1.2em;text-indent:-4px;}
    #footer a:hover{color:silver;}
    #footer ol li{text-indent:-999em;list-style:none;}
    
    
    ul.homelist{padding:0px; margin: 0 0 10px 30px;list-style-type: none;}
    
    
    
    #circular {float:left; width:580px; height:150px; padding:0; margin-bottom:20px;}
    ul.circular {list-style:none;}
    ul.circular li {display:inline; width:150px; padding-right:20px; height:150px;}
    
    #content-nav-marketing {background-color:#000000; width:300px; margin-top:30px;}
    #content-nav-marketing p, h2 {color:#fff; padding-left:6px; padding-top:6px; font-weight:100; font-family:"Times New Roman", Times, serif;}
    
    #header {width:870px; height:116px; padding:0px; margin-left:-4px; clear:both; position:relative;}
    
    #content-main-img{float:right;clear:left; padding-left:4px;}
    #content-nav p{font-size:12px;}
    
    #content-nav-testimonial{width:300px; border-bottom:1px solid #000; border-right:1px solid #000;}
    #content-nav-testimonial p, h1{padding-left:4px;font-weight:100; font-family:"Times New Roman", Times, serif; padding-top:6px;}
    
    #footer p {text-align:left; padding-left:7px; color:#fff; float:left;}
    
    #content-nav a {color:blue;}
    
    ul.homelist li{background-image:url(../images/icons/checkMark.png); background-position:left; background-repeat:no-repeat; text-indent:21px;}
    
    #site-nav li a{line-height:9px; padding-top:5px;}
    #site-nav{background-image:url(../images/navBar.jpg); background-repeat:no-repeat; width:870px; height:49px;}
    #site-nav a{outline:none;}
    
    
    
    #site-nav{position:relative; clear:both; height:100%;}
    #content-main{position:relative; background-color:#fff; min-height:0;}
    #content-nav{position:relative;  padding:0; float:left; background-color:#000; min-height:100%;}
    #wrapper{background-color:#fff; min-height:100%;}
    So there's the code. The content-nav represents the left column and content-main represents the right.

    Any ideas or pointers appreciated.

  14. #1514
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    HI,

    So I've got position: relative; height:100% set on the left column
    As explained in the demo you can't use 100% height like that otherwise there would be no point in all the demos if it were that easy

    There is no mechanism (other than a table or display:table) to make columns equalise in css2.1. You have to resort to one of the methods in the demos or use a repeating background image on the parent to accomplish this.

    There are various methods all of which utilise negative margins to achieve a 100% effect. Perhaps its best if you read this article that explains the issues more clearly.

    http://www.pmob.co.uk/pob/equal-columns.htm

    (The faq on 100% height explains 100% height in a bit more detail also and explains why you can never really use it.)

    Hope that explains it

  15. #1515
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    Cheers Paul, I'll have a read and re-read over the suggested material.

  16. #1516
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    So I followed the code as laid out in the 2column_simple_1 tutorial and to solve the original problem, it worked a treat.

    It has however caused a new issue, with a dropdown navigation menu stretching the width of the site. The drop down links that are position on the nav bar above the #left div get lost behind this div. The links/hover directly above #middle are visible.

    Code:
    html{height:100%;}
    
    body {font-size:62.5%;
    	color:#000;
    	text-align:center;/*centre for ie5 */
    	background:#1b1560;background-image:url(images/bckgrd.jpg); background-repeat:repeat-x; }
    	
    #container {
    	width:870px;
    	background:#000;/*this colour will be left column colour */
    	margin:auto;/* centre for compliant browsers*/
    	text-align:left;
    	border:1px solid #000;
    }
    #header {height:116px; padding:0px;margin:0px;}
    
    #left {
    	margin-left:-299px;/*must be 1 pixel less than width */
    	float:left;
    	width:300px;/* this width is the same as the margin on #middle */
    	position:relative;
    	left:-2px;/* line it up exactly without losing pressure on footer*/
    }
    #left p {padding-left:5px}
    #middle {
    	border-left:1px solid #000;
    	background:#fff;/* background colour of right column */
    	margin-left:300px;/*this is the space for the left column */
    }
    #inner{width:100%;float:left;margin-right:-1px}/* contain cleared elements from clearing other floats*/
    so there's the code for the columns and

    Code:
    /****** Navigation New *****/
    #site-nav ul{padding-left:2px;margin:0 0 0 0px;}
    #site-nav ul li{list-style:none!important;}
    #site-nav li {text-align:center;padding-left:10px;padding-right:10px;height:49px;float:left;position:relative;margin:0 0px; }
    #site-nav li a{text-align:center;width:100%;text-decoration:none;height:100%;display:block;padding:0 5px 0 5px;color:#000;font: 12px "Tahoma","Arial Black",sans-serif ; margin-top:15px;}
    #site-nav li a:hover{background-position: -120px top;color:#666;} 
    
    /***** Dropdown New *****/
    #site-nav li ul{position:absolute;left:-999em;margin:0;top:0;}
    #site-nav li ul li{padding:0 5px;width:123px;height:5px;background:none;margin:0px;float:none;}
    #site-nav li ul li a{font-weight:normal;text-decoration:none;line-height:20px;color:black;white-space: nowrap;}
    #site-nav li ul li a:hover{color:white;}
    #site-nav li:hover ul,#site-nav li.sfhover ul{left:-8px;background:none;padding:30px 0 0 0;}
    #site-nav li:hover ul ul,#site-nav li.sfhover ul ul{left:116px;background:none;padding:0;}
    #site-nav ul li ul li.leaf.sfhover {list-style-type:none!important;} 
    
    
    #site-nav{background-image:url(images/navBar.jpg); background-repeat:no-repeat; width:870px; height:49px; margin-bottom:0px; }
    #site-nav a{outline:none;}
    that's for the navigation bar...

    I've adjusted the obvious things like padding and z-index has no effect either.


    Any thoughts? Cheers.

  17. #1517
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    HI,

    I'd really need to see the live example to debug fully but have you tried applying the z-index to #site-nav?

    e.g.
    Code:
    #site-nav {position:relative;z-index:99}
    If that's not the issue then post a link or post the html as well.

  18. #1518
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    Hi Paul,

    nail -- > head.

    You're a legend, that worked, thank you very much!

  19. #1519
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    I am unsure weather this question belongs in there really. I have a content area, with a navigation area on the left, and the content is floated right. I have managed to get the layout working with min-height:100% and height:100% but what would be ideal is to have the length of the layout decided on however much content is in my content area, which is floated to the right of navigation?

  20. #1520
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    Hi mateymate,

    Welcome to Sitepoint.

    I'm a little unsure of the question so you may need to clarify it for me.

    When you say "length" are you referring to width or height as its a little ambiguous. If you mean "height" then the demo already shows how to have equal columns so I don't think that's what you mean.

    If you can let me know exactly what's required I'm sure we can come up with a solution

    Perhaps you can post the code you have (or supply a link to a working example - I know you can't post links here yet as you haven't enough posts but just replace the dots in the url with a dash.)

  21. #1521
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul O'B View Post
    Hi mateymate,

    Welcome to Sitepoint.

    I'm a little unsure of the question so you may need to clarify it for me.

    When you say "length" are you referring to width or height as its a little ambiguous. If you mean "height" then the demo already shows how to have equal columns so I don't think that's what you mean.

    If you can let me know exactly what's required I'm sure we can come up with a solution

    Perhaps you can post the code you have (or supply a link to a working example - I know you can't post links here yet as you haven't enough posts but just replace the dots in the url with a dash.)
    Figured it out, I had my footer div in the wrong place, so clear:both wasn't working. I have just this second got it working, should be able to upload it soon. Cheers for the reply!

  22. #1522
    SitePoint Member
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    Hey Paul,

    I used your two column design for a website and was just wondering if you could take a quick look and explain to me why the left hand navigation is partially obscured in ie6?

    Cheers

    Charlie

    PS. As I don't have the required post level could you PM me and I'll send you the link.

  23. #1523
    The CSS Clinic is open silver trophybronze trophy
    Paul O'B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bazeboiee View Post

    PS. As I don't have the required post level could you PM me and I'll send you the link.
    hey Charlie just post the link here but leave the "http://www." part off and it should render as text in the post.

  24. #1524
    SitePoint Enthusiast
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    Hey Paul,

    any tips for achieving a 4-equal column centered layout without using background images. I've been trying to come up with the answer myself this evening using an amalgamation of examples on your site but I'm getting nowhere fast.

    Cheers.

  25. #1525
    In memoriam gold trophysilver trophybronze trophy Dan Schulz's Avatar
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    Where do you want the columns, and what will be in them?


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