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  1. #1
    SitePoint Wizard DougBTX's Avatar
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    No anti flash thread?

    I saw a good flash page, but when I came here I couldn't find any recent Flash vs. Standards threads. The shame. That means I'll have to start one myself.

    I want to talk about this page.

    I think it is good use of Flash. Even responds to the forward and backward buttons in the browser. Nice.

    And guess what? It is a content based Flash file, with an article about designing for web standards. Just too good not to post

    Douglas
    Hello World

  2. #2
    SitePoint Addict delpino's Avatar
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    I think there shouldn't be a Flash vs Standards thread, both have its purposes..
    Last edited by delpino; Oct 29, 2003 at 11:07.
    http://www.antosch-and-lin.com - Language Learning

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    y'know they aer probably serving that data as xml, I wonder how hard it would be to put a switcher in there to transform the xml to xhtml or send it into flash as the user desired...

    BTW I like this use of flash, for me it is perfecto, but I haven't really looked at it from the pov of accessibility etc

  4. #4
    SitePoint Wizard DougBTX's Avatar
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    Yea, that's what they are doing. They had an article about that a while ago too.

    Douglas
    Hello World

  5. #5
    Ensure you finish what you sta bronze trophy John Colby's Avatar
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    Douglas gave us a link. The flash has text in it. Great!

    15-20% of people have some soft of congitive difficulty that can be classed within the realms of dyslexia. They need assistive technologies.

    I'm using a text reader designed for dyslexia - I don't have the condition, just specify the tools for use in this University Faculty.

    It reads not a word.

    Go figure.
    John
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  6. #6
    webdesign Percept's Avatar
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    The text also isn't selectable ( there is a printversion availble but they should have made the text selectable if they were goin for usabillity )


  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Colby
    Douglas gave us a link. The flash has text in it. Great!

    15-20% of people have some soft of congitive difficulty that can be classed within the realms of dyslexia. They need assistive technologies.

    I'm using a text reader designed for dyslexia - I don't have the condition, just specify the tools for use in this University Faculty.

    It reads not a word.

    Go figure.
    what tool is this?
    and how exactly does it work, also how does it handle html?

    also
    HI!

  8. #8
    Ensure you finish what you sta bronze trophy John Colby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pissant
    what tool is this?
    and how exactly does it work, also how does it handle html?

    also
    HI!
    It works like this - if you can select the text it'll read it.

    It's Read and Write V6 Gold, from http://www.texthelp.com.

    It reads web pages, word, excel, powerpoint, PDF files and has a variety of voices and accents. It also assists when creating text - it'll read back what you type in word, has homophonic spell checking and practically every tool that people with difficulties need.

    If you want more information send me an email and I'll respond.

    And the problem with the Flash was that you couldn't select the text.
    John
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  9. #9
    + platinum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Percept
    The text also isn't selectable ( there is a printversion availble but they should have made the text selectable if they were goin for usabillity )
    Yeah

    But, I do think it's pretty cool all-in-all, love the back/forward buttons working

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by platinum
    Yeah

    But, I do think it's pretty cool all-in-all, love the back/forward buttons working
    That's awsome! Does anyone know how they did that? Isn't it just one flash file?

  11. #11
    SitePoint Wizard DougBTX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Colby
    And the problem with the Flash was that you couldn't select the text.
    How does your app work with this example?

    http://www.redmelon.net/tstme/FlashSelect/

    You should be able to select all the text (including the text in the header, which is at the bottom...)

    The page also seems to validate, but hardly the point.

    Douglas
    Hello World

  12. #12
    Ensure you finish what you sta bronze trophy John Colby's Avatar
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    The application parses the web page - but as the text isn't part of the web page, then it doesn't work.

    And the page does not display in Firebird - although other flash pages do.
    John
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  13. #13
    SitePoint Wizard DougBTX's Avatar
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    Strange, works fine in Opera. I'll have a look at that.

    You said it could read selectable text, the example should be selectable...

    granted it won't do anything for your search engine ratings though

    Douglas
    Hello World

  14. #14
    SitePoint Wizard DougBTX's Avatar
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    My remaining respect for moz just whent down the drain.

    I foolishly thought that it was the standards compliant code which made Moz works, looks like I was wrong. Even, I can get it to work fine with standards complaint <object> tags... as long as there is no doctype.

    Needless to say Opera and IE get it all right.

    Douglas
    Hello World

  15. #15
    Ensure you finish what you sta bronze trophy John Colby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DougBTX
    You said it could read selectable text, the example should be selectable...
    Yes - I'd never tested it on Flash before.
    John
    No electrons were harmed during the creation, transmission
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by tempus
    That's awsome! Does anyone know how they did that? Isn't it just one flash file?
    I'm assuming you mean the back/forward...
    quite easily done with named anchors in flash...
    has been available since flash 5
    in flash 3-4 was possible, but required js/as workarounds

    As for the non-selectable text, this is a bummer, because you can easily make text selectable in flash, but then you have to increase your file size due to font issues...

    This current flash move should be able to be read by traditional screen readers such as JAWS,
    I was lookign that the texthelp site and I couldn't find much developer information. However I am on a really bad dial-up connection today and haven't exactly searched their pages.

    I must admit that as a flash developer I do often find it very frustrating when I spend a lot of time making my work accessible only to have another previously unheard of product pop-up and need another whole set of hoops to jump through.
    I'm not saying we shouldn't jump, but it is painful. I know many people do not like flash, but I really wish W3C would adopt some kind of swf standard so that we could begin to use flash easier and tie it in to all the different assisstive devices available.

  17. #17
    Ensure you finish what you sta bronze trophy John Colby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pissant
    I'm not saying we shouldn't jump, but it is painful. I know many people do not like flash, but I really wish W3C would adopt some kind of swf standard so that we could begin to use flash easier and tie it in to all the different assisstive devices available.
    swf is a commercial standard, not an open or royalty free standard. W3C have a patent policy, under which I think this falls, at http://www.w3c.org/Consortium/Patent...-20030520.html and as such it's not up to the W3C but the developers to make their standards royalty free.
    John
    No electrons were harmed during the creation, transmission
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Colby
    swf is a commercial standard, not an open or royalty free standard. W3C have a patent policy, under which I think this falls, at http://www.w3c.org/Consortium/Patent...-20030520.html and as such it's not up to the W3C but the developers to make their standards royalty free.
    Perhaps I didn't explain myself clearly, but I just keep finding assistive devices that require different things from both my html and flash work.
    One tries to be accessible but it is difficult to know exactly what is needed by the different audiences. I wish makers of these tools would make use of the strengths of flash and html when developing their tools. I do however understand many of the difficulties revolving around this wish


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