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  1. #51
    Fluffy Kitten Programmer~ Elledan's Avatar
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    To be honest, I dislike all browsers when I'm running Windows. They all have faults and crash too much (IE the whole system if you're out of luck), so it's more like the OS sucks than the browsers.

    In Linux, I like them all
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  2. #52
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    I use netscape because its easier to view bookmarks and because when I started using the Internet, Netscape was the browser I learned to use. Sometimes it errors on me yes, but I only use IE when I am desperate.

  3. #53
    SitePoint Wizard creole's Avatar
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    Originally posted by clueless
    but I only use IE when I am desperate.
    desperate for what? Desperate for browser that supports stylesheets? Desperate for a browser that has support for the Javascript DOM? Desperate for a browser that offers nearly every bit of HTML 4 tags plus extras? Right...you can keep Netscape...or better yet, throw it out with the bathwater...
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  4. #54
    Fluffy Kitten Programmer~ Elledan's Avatar
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    One reason to not use IE is that it is too integrated into Windows, which can be very unconvenient. That's one reason why NS is easier to configure: you've everything in one menu instead of spread all over the OS.
    www.nyanko.ws - My web-, software- and game development company.
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  5. #55
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    Originally posted by Elledan
    One reason to not use IE is that it is too integrated into Windows, which can be very unconvenient. That's one reason why NS is easier to configure: you've everything in one menu instead of spread all over the OS.
    One reason to use IE is that it is fully integrated into Windows, which can be very convenient. That's one reason NS is harder to configure: it may have everything in one menu, but it can't communicate with much of the OS.

  6. #56
    Fluffy Kitten Programmer~ Elledan's Avatar
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    Originally posted by etLux
    Originally posted by Elledan
    One reason to not use IE is that it is too integrated into Windows, which can be very unconvenient. That's one reason why NS is easier to configure: you've everything in one menu instead of spread all over the OS.
    One reason to use IE is that it is fully integrated into Windows, which can be very convenient. That's one reason NS is harder to configure: it may have everything in one menu, but it can't communicate with much of the OS.
    Well, you could see the fact that NS isn't really integrated as an advantage since you don't mess with the OS itself.

    But anyway, I'm more and more becoming a Linux freak, so I'll have to leave IE behind someday when my PC runs only Linux...

    Not certain yet whether I'll really mind
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  7. #57
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    Elledan, I was, of course, pointing up that there are two ways of looking at this.

    Integration with a vastly powerful OS environment like Windows allows tremendous flexibility and capability with a minimum of external overhead.

    On the other hand, remaining separate from the OS and rewriting cold code to duplicate all of the services offered by the OS offers advantages such as... such as...

    Somebody help me out here?

  8. #58
    SitePoint Guru
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    Originally posted by etLux
    On the other hand, remaining separate from the OS and rewriting cold code to duplicate all of the services offered by the OS offers advantages such as... such as...
    Well when the browser screws up it is less likely that the OS is brought down with it.

  9. #59
    Your Lord and Master, Foamy gold trophy Hierophant's Avatar
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    You can tell IE to always browse in a separate process (Start->Settings->Control Panel->Internet Options->Advanced (Tab)->Click on "Run Browser in Separate Process").

    Doing this strongly descreases the likelihood of IE bring down your OS, but it increases resource usage because each window is a separate application now.

    Just running Netscape 6 has caused some PC's OSes to be compromised in my office.
    Wayne Luke
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  10. #60
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    Thanks for the reminder on that, Wayne. Only very rarely, by the way, have I seen IE crash the whole operating system... at least in the last year or two. NS, on the other hand, *especially* NS6, chronically crashes on over a dozen systems here -- half the time yanking down the whole OS with it.

  11. #61
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    Yup, its a good idea to run it as a seperate process, except it might not be so viable on an older system.

    etLux I guess my experience with Netscape (4.x and Mozilla nightly builds, Netscape 6 is a piece of trash) is better than yours, because I don't ever recall Netscape bringing my OS down.

    While IE is generally more stable, there has been a couple times I needed to reboot after IE goes kaput.

    Again these are my personal experiences, and not based on any scientific observation whatsoever.

  12. #62
    SitePoint Wizard TWTCommish's Avatar
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    Thanks for the tip Wayne - I didn't know that!

    So basically, IE can be run seperately. AND it supports the most updated forms of Style Sheets, JavaScript, and other such things. It also displays more pages properly formatted. These are the reasons why, for me, the choice is clear.

  13. #63
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    Originally posted by creole
    Originally posted by clueless
    but I only use IE when I am desperate.
    desperate for what? Desperate for browser that supports stylesheets? Desperate for a browser that has support for the Javascript DOM? Desperate for a browser that offers nearly every bit of HTML 4 tags plus extras? Right...you can keep Netscape...or better yet, throw it out with the bathwater...
    Do I sense that you don't like Netscape? I prefer Netscape because I have used it for several years. You prefer IE because it gives you more features. Its not a big deal. I have to use IE for some things, like some webpages that lock up in netscape, or when I am checking what my site design looks like for people using IE.

    I also don't like IE because that is the browser that comes with AOL (which I no longer use, but my parents do) and I have to make sure my mom uses netscape because the AOL browser is a piece of junk.

    One think I don't like about Netscape is that it comes with AOL IM and I hate that. However, I must have figured how to get it off my personal toolbar.


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  14. #64
    SitePoint Wizard TWTCommish's Avatar
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    Heck, it's your right, but using a browser that you yourself admit locks up on some pages for no apparent reason just because you've used it for awhile doesn't, to me at least, make a whole lot of sense. Don't take that the wrong way!

    By the way: I hate America Online, but AOL is the reason AOL's browser sucks, it's got nothing to do with IE, I don't think.

  15. #65
    SitePoint Wizard creole's Avatar
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    clueless...

    you;re darn tootin' I don't like NS. The only reason I ever even open it is to see how it will butcher the page I am working on.

    As for AOL...true that the browser is IE, but it is a crappy version of IE customized for AOL users. It is basically a stripped down version of IE 4.X. But that is not really IE's fault. It is AOL's fault that they dupe their users into believing that what they see on AOL is the real internet. What a bunch of lemmings.

    As for "checking your pages in IE". If you are web designer, then it should be the other way around. No offense, but that is somewhat foolish. Stats prove time and time again that nearly 80% of users have at least IE 4 or higher on their computers (and more in some cases).

    It is your job to make sure that the majority of your users get the best possbible experience while making sure that the others don't see a broken site.

    of course that is just my opinion.
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  16. #66
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    I don't know about anyone else, but my Netscape browser goes down on a REGULAR basis...so I then use IE
    Then the problem just fixes itself

    Annoying

    P.S. Does anybody know how to get Netscape to properly support colored table borders. I'm just about done my site and when I preview it in my Netscape browser, the color is kinda grey with a "shade" of the color I need on the fringes. Really eats into my design theme if you know what I mean. Thanks
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  17. #67
    will code HTML for food Michel V's Avatar
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    Anyone here tried to completely uninstall IE ?
    I mean, a COMPLETE uninstall with 98lite.

    I did that and Netscape was way faster than it was before ! Actually much faster than IE.


    Made me wonder why IE is so integrated in the OS....... to win the browsers' war by slowing down the opponents ?
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  18. #68
    The Hiding One lynlimz's Avatar
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    Hmm..Lotsa people ramlbing..I'm here to join in the fun! heez..
    I don't really have any disagreements with any of you...you must realise there's a reason why everybody is different.

    However, I must admit that Netscape is slow.
    I'm running AMD Athlon TB 1ghz with 256 sdram and Netscape 6 still tkaes a long time to load ( several seconds ...like 10? ). In fact, Netscape 4 even loaded faster.

    In my opinion, it is not the browser that is slow. Its the things that they add into Netscpae. Like all the AOL crap etc. If you try Mozilla Milestones builds and netscape 6, you'll notice that mozilla browser are faster.

    And if you're wondering that IE too installs other stuffs, you must understand they are integrated into windows and run as a separate process. Beneath the code, IE is seperated from the rest of the program it installs.

    Both browsers crash on me. But you really thing anything is crashproof in this world? ( You do fall sick do you? )

    Nonetheless, eveyrone has their own opinions....no one has the right to intefer with their opinions...why ramble about it?

    At the most, if its all so easy as you think, why not go create your own browser to your satisfaction?

    Juz my thoughts..couldn't hold it within me...after reading those 3 pages of posts,...heehz.. =)

    Enjoy you day!
    "Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world."
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  19. #69
    SitePoint Wizard edshuck's Avatar
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    hi all

    I use IE.

    I like Netscape and IE and am pleased that both are available. And I like the price.

    Naturally there are variations in the compatibility of features. But working through those, relatively minor problems, is OK with me.

    Good thread


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