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  1. #1
    SitePoint Wizard Another Designer's Avatar
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    Unhappy I have not had a full time job in 5 sad years!!!

    Remember me?
    I have not had a full time job in 5 sad years! Sure, I had a few small freelance jobs here or there. I have had lots of interviews. But I have not been hired! So sad.
    I guess the game is over for me. Very sad indeed!
    Is 53 too old to continue in this field? I'm guessing I'm washed up.
    What do your think?
    How about careers that don't have age discrimination. Is there such a thing?
    5 YEARS MY FRIENDS! 5 YEARS!

  2. #2
    Is Still Alive silver trophybronze trophy RetroNetro's Avatar
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    Yes.
    That's a long time. What kind of work have you been looking for? Web Design? Are you trying to find jobs locally where you "goto the office" or are you looking for remote work online?
    Not necessarily, but you will have to be more positive in order to achieve your goals. (I'm not a licensed therapist)
    No, 53 is not too old.
    If any career does not have age discrimination it is web development. I know teenagers and guys that are 53+ (and all ages in between) that do web design.

  3. #3
    SitePoint Wizard Another Designer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RetroNetro View Post
    Yes.
    That's a long time. What kind of work have you been looking for? Web Design? Are you trying to find jobs locally where you "goto the office" or are you looking for remote work online?
    Not necessarily, but you will have to be more positive in order to achieve your goals. (I'm not a licensed therapist)
    No, 53 is not too old.
    If any career does not have age discrimination it is web development. I know teenagers and guys that are 53+ (and all ages in between) that do web design.
    Nothing has worked for me. I don't know how to find clients.
    I have been relying on job boards.
    I did flash, static web design, photography, video editing... ect...

  4. #4
    SitePoint Wizard Another Designer's Avatar
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    Anyone else?

  5. #5
    SitePoint Mentor bronze trophy
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    Do you have your own website, complete with portfolio, resume and blog?
    Learn how to be ready for The New Move to Discourse

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  6. #6
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    Social networks are great for connecting with the potential employers; especially LinkedIn. Make sure that you have a complete informative profile on LinkedIn. This surely helps.

  7. #7
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    53 ? It's gonna be very hard to still be able to get hired by an employer :s

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Another Designer View Post
    I did flash, static web design, photography, video editing... ect...
    Sounds like quite a selection. I don't believe its your fault but we're heading or are in a global financial crisis. It was only a matter of time before it hit the web and design industries.

    Do you have a website portfolio?

  9. #9
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    I am thinking maybe you could sell some of your designs on themeforest web site

  10. #10
    SitePoint Wizard
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    I really do not think it's the age. Perhaps some of the company did factor in that but I'm sure that not all of the company felt that way.
    In fact, I know a guy in 60's still programming like a rock star. If you really want help then posting your resume would draw clearer picture on why you're not landing a new job. Could it be that your skillset is outdated?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by sg707 View Post
    Could it be that your skillset is outdated?
    I don't think that photography or video editing would become dated. I do think flash might be seeing Apple no longer supports it.

    I dont think the OP was talking about programming, is a slightly different field I think.

  12. #12
    SitePoint Addict bronze trophy WolfShade's Avatar
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    The things I can tell you regarding today's hiring process (some already mentioned by others, here):
    1. Chronological resume. I've seen people submit "accomplishment" resumes, and the people who make the decision (whether it's HR or the lead developer) usually want chronological resumes.
    2. Online portfolio. People who make the hiring decisions want an online site that displays your talent (either publicly viewable, or a secure login); they want to see what you can do.
    3. Networking. Look in the local newspaper for 'occupation/job networking opportunities'. These are professionals who are in the same boat as you, but they might know of a potential employer looking for your skills - maybe they heard something during a previous interview that can help you. There are often-times potential employers attending, too.
    4. Certification. If you can get certified in your proficiency, it goes a long way; a diploma would be better, but a cert definitely doesn't hurt. Most community colleges have some kind of "web specialization" cert. AND, the community college most likely has a counselor who can help you pick and choose the courses that you need to get hired.
    5. Positive, can-do attitude. I hate to be down, but your post has a lot of negative energy. If this is the energy you bring to an interview, no one will hire you. Period. Become a "yes"-man. "Yeah, I can do that." or "I can learn that, very quickly." Be energetic, and enthusiastic.

  13. #13
    SitePoint Wizard webcosmo's Avatar
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    Why didn`t anyone give you a job? Was it because of age or because you didn`t meet their standards ?

  14. #14
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    I agree with previous poster. You need to be positive and ready to learn. You have to ask for trials and be ready to work as a contractor at first if that is what on offer. There are many other portals where you can bid for works. For example, Odesk is one of those platforms. You have to believe in yourself even nobody else believe in you.

  15. #15
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    I truly don't think that it is a question of age.

    Age may be a challenge in an interview, depeding on what they expect. Maybe those companies were expecting someone so much younger because he wouldn't hesitate to accept a lower salary.

    The thing is that you need to ask yourself why you didn't get any jobs (freelancing or not)

    You also need to ask yourself what you want to do with your life.

  16. #16
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    An accountant highlighted the fact that I was not hungry enough but when my collateral was drained my outlook certainly changed.

    What have you done for cash over the past five years

    Or is this just a troll post?
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  17. #17
    SitePoint Wizard Another Designer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John_Betong View Post
    Do you have your own website, complete with portfolio, resume and blog?
    I have a website that's done in flash. I have photos in flickr, a Twitter account and a FB photo account. I am also on Linkedin.

    Quote Originally Posted by Autofits View Post
    Social networks are great for connecting with the potential employers; especially LinkedIn. Make sure that you have a complete informative profile on LinkedIn. This surely helps.
    Twitter account and a FB photo account. I am also on Linkedin.

    Quote Originally Posted by drake20 View Post
    53 ? It's gonna be very hard to still be able to get hired by an employer :s
    And thank you for making me feel 1000 times worse!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiwiheretic View Post
    Sounds like quite a selection. I don't believe its your fault but we're heading or are in a global financial crisis. It was only a matter of time before it hit the web and design industries.

    Do you have a website portfolio?
    Yes I have a website made from Flash. I have to redo it using CSS and HTML.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiwiheretic View Post
    I am thinking maybe you could sell some of your designs on theme forest web site
    I'm not sure I understand. I want to make a good living. I'm tired of struggling financially. Your way doesn't sound very lucrative. But I will look into it.

    Quote Originally Posted by John_Betong View Post
    An accountant highlighted the fact that I was not hungry enough but when my collateral was drained my outlook certainly changed.

    What have you done for cash over the past five years

    Or is this just a troll post?

    WHY DOES EVERYONE ALWAYS THINK I AM A FREAKING TROLL? NO MATTER WHAT FORUM I GO TO PEOPLE THINK I AM A TROLL!! NO, I AM NOT A TROLL!!!
    My wife works. She brings in the money. Go ahead, put me down for that too.




    Quote Originally Posted by molona View Post
    I truly don't think that it is a question of age.

    Age may be a challenge in an interview, depeding on what they expect. Maybe those companies were expecting someone so much younger because he wouldn't hesitate to accept a lower salary.

    The thing is that you need to ask yourself why you didn't get any jobs (freelancing or not)

    You also need to ask yourself what you want to do with your life.

    I have been passed up for jobs I was clearly qualified for. It's my age and it's a fact that I am interviewed by females. Do you realize not one job I have gotten in the last 20 years was a job where a female interviewed me? Seriously, they were all men! Men are discriminated against in my country. It's true!


    Quote Originally Posted by talkcarinsurance View Post
    I agree with previous poster. You need to be positive and ready to learn. You have to ask for trials and be ready to work as a contractor at first if that is what on offer. There are many other portals where you can bid for works. For example, Odesk is one of those platforms. You have to believe in yourself even nobody else believe in you.

    Yes, I should look into this portals!


    Quote Originally Posted by webcosmo View Post
    Why didn`t anyone give you a job? Was it because of age or because you didn`t meet their standards ?
    I think it was mostly because of my age. Of course there are better designers out there. Perhaps I am not showing them my work during the interview. I sent them links via email. Maybe I should just show printed material on a black backboard. I think that might be part of the problem too.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Another Designer View Post


    WHY DOES EVERYONE ALWAYS THINK I AM A FREAKING TROLL? NO MATTER WHAT FORUM I GO TO PEOPLE THINK I AM A TROLL!! NO, I AM NOT A TROLL!!!
    My wife works. She brings in the money. Go ahead, put me down for that too.

    From what I understand about themeforest you can also find out what designs are selling there, even if you decide not to use themeforest. It was just a thought.

    Also, I don't think you are a troll. I honestly don't understand why anyone would post such a thing.

    However I do think flash is on the way out so, if I were you, I would look to upskilling myself on html5 and css3, so that your web design skills stay relevant for the large numbers of mobile Apple product users.

    I do think that some of the people in the web design/development industry are deluding themselves that believe PHP and MySql "quick and dirty" PHP scripts are "future proof". Just because some of those PHP gurus may be able to find work now is no guarantee that there will be PHP work in the future. Some people are too arrogant to admit that luck, rather than their superior business acumen, played a large role in them getting work. (This comment not directed to @Another Designer ; just in case there is any doubt.)

    @Another Designer ; With your skills and background, might I suggest that media productions (sort of like ultranormal.com if it still exists) might be something you could look at also, especially in association with your video photography skills.
    Last edited by molona; Mar 26, 2014 at 10:30. Reason: adding semi-colons and correcting @'s

  19. #19
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    molona's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Another Designer View Post
    I have been passed up for jobs I was clearly qualified for. It's my age and it's a fact that I am interviewed by females. Do you realize not one job I have gotten in the last 20 years was a job where a female interviewed me? Seriously, they were all men! Men are discriminated against in my country.
    I don't care if men are discriminated in your country or not. If that's really true, then you'll have to learn to jump that barrier. If you really want to get a good job, the one thing you can't do, you can't afford to do, is to stay where you are. If it is not discrimination (either for your gender or age), then it will be something else. There will be always a barrier to get a job, even if it is something as simple like someone else is applying for the same position.

    The very first thing is not about what you know but about being realistic about your expectives (in this case, job-wise)

    You need to ask yourself questions like:

    - Do I really want to do this? Do I enjoy it?
    - If I don't, what would I like to do with my life?
    - If I do, are my skills really good enough? Am I behind from the rest?
    - How can I go the extra mile?

    In terms of doing an interview
    - Am I pleasant enough? Is my character nice enough? Is it easy for me to make friends? Am I sociable?

    If the answer is not, what do I need to do to get a job? how do I present myself in such a way that I don't lie but they don't see my shyness (or introspective way of being) as something negative?

    - how do I market myself so the age is not a concern
    - Am I targeting to the appropriate job? Maybe I shouln't be only a designer but more like a manager or assistant manager with all my experience... Do I have the skills to manage a team?
    - What am I doing wrong?

    And be constant, everyday. Whatever you do, whatever field you choose, learn something new and get better, every day.

    You DO have a job but you haven't realize that... YOUR JOB IS TO GET A JOB and that's also a full time job. That means that you need to organize your time to:

    Read newspapers, online media (websites, linkedIn or any serious place where you can find jobs) and see what's available. From there, select those jobs that you think would suit you.

    Study the companies you want to apply for. Change your CV accordingly to target each one of them. Personalize it. Look at their sites, their philosophy, their style.
    If they're classic in the way they look, your resumè should look classic still outstanding enough to be memorable. If they're more bold with their brand, be more bold with your presentation. Adapt to the market.

    Dedicate some time to study and be better on whatever you do. Everyday. No excuses. Put yourself to the test.

    Realize that internet gives you lots of way of making cash. You think that themeforest is not a place for you because a template is sold at 15USD?
    It is fine that you don't want to do that kind of business. But remember that some of those designers (or groups, because most of them are really groups of designers, programmers, coders...) earn thousands of USD per month.

    They do so because they know their market well, and they adapt and they're the best at what they do. That doesn't mean that you should sell themes at themeforest. You need to understand why they're successfull.

    Learn from them. You need to adapt too.

    Look also to other line of business that may suit you even better. You could sell your own e-book, you could have your online store, you could have your own online course. Or maybe teach people in your own city, organizing classical, short-period courses.

    Mind you, don't expect results straight away. NOTHING IS EASY. But if you really know what you want to do and you're constant, you'll start seeing results in a few months.

    If you jump from one line of business to another, thinking that nothing works... nothing will work because you didn't dedicate enough to time to that particular line or you didn't understand how the market worked.

    PS: My sisters always pestered me because I was overweight, far overweight, and that looking good was so important to do an interview that I would have trouble finding one. First impressions are important. And they're right, up to a point. Maybe I don't get the salary I deserve because I don't look good.
    I'm not precisely a model. I'm not pretty. I'm not social.
    Still, they were really wrong. I never had a problem finding a job because:
    a) I knew my stuff really well. I always worked hard, I'm honest, I'm straight forward. And whenever someone asked to any of my previous employers, they are pleasantly surprised.
    b) I know how to behave, what to say and what not to say either if they're important or not. I always show respect. I know how to dress for the occassion. I'm not social but I know how to make someone feel comfortable.
    c) I always deliver. My job is always on time and if something delays me and I can't find another way to make it work, my boss is properly informed.

    What I don't have in looks (or age, I'm not young), I have in some other skill. And I make sure that I don't allienate anyone. Of course, if I don't agree with someone, I tell him. But I make sure that it is an opinion exchange, not a fight

  20. #20
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    John_Betong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Another Designer View Post
    Yes I have a website made from Flash. I have to redo it using CSS and HTML.
    ...
    I have photos in flickr, a Twitter account and a FB photo account. I am also on Linkedin.

    ...
    Perhaps I am not showing them my work during the interview.
    ...


    How about submitting your updated website for a SitePoint Review?
    Last edited by John_Betong; Mar 26, 2014 at 11:22. Reason: formatting
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  21. #21
    SitePoint Wizard Another Designer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John_Betong View Post


    How about submitting your updated website for a SitePoint Review?
    I really would like to. But then everyone would know who Hard Luck Charlie really is.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Another Designer View Post
    I really would like to. But then everyone would know who Hard Luck Charlie really is.
    After creating your website, send a Personal Message to @HAWK ; who I am sure will issue another user name so you may remain anonymous.
    Learn how to be ready for The New Move to Discourse

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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Another Designer View Post
    Anyone else?
    WHere are you from?

  24. #24
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    I read this threads & fell sad for another disigner. I also suffer same problem.

  25. #25
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    By all means, I am asking it very seriously. About 15 IT years of experience, I have worked with 1 designer who proved to be useless. I do work from HTML/CSS/Javascript, server side programming, and everything in between. Perhaps, I really should say I worked with 0 designers because he was fired very quickly after knowing what he can provide. I am sure there are better designers out there. Anyways, let me get back to my original point. Most application I build are really SPA (Single Page Application) oriented and there are vast array of commercial/open source UI frameworks like Bootstrap. I've never really had to create the best looking Grid Table or Tree Menu. In fact, I don't remember creating a custom components for a very long time. When I design an application, this is my process

    * Use Border Layout (North/West/Center/East/South)
    * Put Global Application menu on North
    * Put Context sensitive menu on Left
    * Put Context sensitive content on Center
    * Put footer info on South

    Then I use either Bootstrap/ExtJS/etc.. to design it. By all means, I'm not an expert in CSS to create the most jazzy looking UI but my customers were always 100% satisfied with opensource/commercial UI that I've used. With this said, what is the value of hiring a designer? I'm pretty sure a single designer can not out do what's provided by commercial UI like ExtJS/KendoUI/Wijmo. It could be my ignorance that I do not know the value of designer but as of now, I can not recommend hiring a full time designer to my customers.


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