Man, what happened to you? Did ascii art pour sugar in your gas-tank or something?Quote:
Originally Posted by redux
Man, what happened to you? Did ascii art pour sugar in your gas-tank or something?Quote:
Originally Posted by redux
I suppose then making art and sculpture from aluminum cans or industrial steel or just regular junk is a 'perversion' too [img]images/smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img]Quote:
Originally Posted by redux
A word does come to my mind when I see these things, including ASCII art, and that word isn't peversion, it's creativity.
But even with that there's a fine line isn't there? Tables are supposed to be used for tabular data only; is a layout table a perversion, or simply creative?Quote:
Originally Posted by beetle
Yes, vgarcia, but we are talking about using text to create art. Art can be anything, which is why an object's original purpose is irrelevant.
See the difference?
ok, are we talking about art or about standards-based code (looks at thread title again, just to make sure) ? because if we're talking art, this discussion could probably go on forever, as any bad, inappropriate or otherwise wrong use of tags can be justified as art. heck, IE only proprietary extensions to html and css can be called art as well...
no difference, because following that reasoning, using a table to create an artistic layout is just as valid.Quote:
Originally Posted by beetle
no need to roll your eyes, because the answer is yes :goof:Quote:
Originally Posted by beetle
and for those not in the know (and i thought i would have made it clear by adding my ad-hoc definition in brackets), "perversion" does not just carry negative sexual connotations...
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=perversion
and by that definition any "non standard" use of tags (e.g. using structural tags to achieve a visual effect) is a perversion.Quote:
diverting from the true intent or object; [...] a turning or applying to a wrong end or use
You're confusing content and markup. The tangent we went off on was marking up ascii art with <pre>, not that <pre> was art.Quote:
Originally Posted by redux
Considering all of the above, this thread is art.
Let's sell it to the MoMA.
Rik
Does the standards-based code live in a vacuum? Are we only allowed to use it to mark up pedantic opinions about standards-based code?Quote:
Originally Posted by redux
Whether ASCII art is "art" or not (I'd call it more of a craft, personally), it exists, it exists on the web, and as a consequence of that, it has to be marked-up by something or other. There is no <ascii-art> element, thus the <pre> element, with its connotation of "the text inside me has significant white space" is a good choice, IMHO. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but <p> is used in much the same way (is everything marked up with <p> really a paragraph? What's a paragraph anyway, but typographic convention, doesn'n't that make it presentational?) Not to mention, of course, <div> and <span>.
well, that's a perversion of the tag as well then.Quote:
Originally Posted by anode
in a structural sense, paragraph denotes a "chunk" of text -although the W3C are now extending it to meanQuote:
What's a paragraph anyway, but typographic convention, doesn'n't that make it presentational?) Not to mention, of course, <div> and <span>.
.Quote:
XHTML2's paragraphs represent the conceptual idea of a paragraph, and so may contain lists, blockquotes, pre's and tables as well as inline text
true, convention has it that paragraphs begin on new lines, and usually indented. heck, the "graph" part of the word indicates that there is a visual, graphic element to it. so true, paragraphs as such have presentational connotations. divs and spans, however, do not, imho...as there is no "burden" of visual convention for them.
oh, as for ascii art, this struck me as interesting
http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml2/mod-block-text.html#sec_8.8.Quote:
Also note that there is no normative requirement that the <pre> element be rendered in a monospace font (although this is the default rendering), nor that text wrapping be disabled.
Good thing that's in XHTML2 which will meet about as much success as VRML ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by redux
Off Topic:
New element needed:
<perversions>
:lol: possiblyQuote:
Originally Posted by jofa
Quote:
Originally Posted by jofa
Off Topic:
to go with a new doctype
Code:<!DOCTYPE artml PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD ArtML 1.0 Strictly Art//EN"
"http://www.asciiart.com/artml-strictlu_art.dtd">
Quote:
Originally Posted by redux
Off Topic:
Will there be a transitional doctype as well, for those of us that wish to use smilies for layout? :p:tup:
Off Topic:
:lol::lol::lol:
Don't forget to add the correct meta information:Code:<meta name="pervert" value="Rik" />
Well..
Imagine that you are creating a web form which is lengthy and designed in a special way... and you want the user to logically jump from one input field to another in the way you want, what can you do in order to control his "Tab" clicks?
Here comes the real benifit of the input tag's property "tabindex"!
It's similar to the VB form control.. when using it, you will have a 100% control over the tab clicks.. and the user will go to the next field you desire!
For Example:
---------------------
<form action="">
<p>
<label>User Name
<input type="text" name="textfield2" tabindex="1">
</label>
</p>
<p>
<label>Email
<input type="text" name="textfield" tabindex="2">
</label>
</p>
<p>
<label>Submit
<input type="submit" name="Submit" value="Submit" tabindex="3">
</label>
</p>
</form>
---------------------
Most of the web designers/developers doesn't use this property.. try it!
No one has mentioned <nobr> ? Or is it so common?
Lifesaver anyway when you must force text & images & whatever in one line and you don't have to do this:
there is no line break
-->
<nobr>ther is no line break</nobr>
-Z-
Great thread :tup:
I am pleased to report that having read from start to finish the only tag I was unaware of/have never used was Redux's "<q>". Shame it's buggy 'cos I'd have loads of uses for it otherwise - why is is buggy exactly?
i think it's because nobr is deprecated in favour of using CSS' "white-space: nowrap;"
coz it don't work... :pQuote:
Originally Posted by TheOriginalH
IE throws a monkey in the works... http://diveintomark.org/archives/200...the_q_tag.html
Yep, tabindex is a nice attribute :)
Example of bad, and very common, tabbing order in a form:
name > password > "forgot password?" > submit
User enters name, tab, enters password, tab, and finally press Enter... :D
<nobr> ?
...element "NOBR" undefined...
I think it is buggy because Microsoft doesn't support it properly.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOriginalH
<nobr> was never part of any HTML standard, but IE and Netscape supported it, hence its wide use. The white-space property in CSS is much better suited to the task IMO.